Front Brake Vibration
-
- Former Member
- Posts: 327
- Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2016 9:57 pm
- RX-8: 231
- Colour: Stormy Blue
- Location: London
- Has thanked: 3 times
- Been thanked: 22 times
Front Brake Vibration
I've recently started to experience vibration of the the front brakes. It has crept in over the last several weeks, and now the ABS and traction control lights come on and stay on. I will take the car in to be looked at, but what are the chances that it just needs new pads? The discs (standard) and pads (Mintex 1144) were replaced 18 months/12k miles ago, and 80% of those miles have been motorway miles. It doesn't feel like they should need replacing yet, but "feelings" frequently mislead me!
-
- Former Member
- Posts: 1454
- Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2018 8:27 pm
- RX-8: 231
- Colour: Velocity Red
- Location: Shropshire
- Has thanked: 16 times
- Been thanked: 87 times
Re: Front Brake Vibration
Probably won't be a simple case of replacing your pads. If you have a search on here there are lots of posts about this type of thing.Hopkins wrote:I've recently started to experience vibration of the the front brakes. It has crept in over the last several weeks, and now the ABS and traction control lights come on and stay on. I will take the car in to be looked at, but what are the chances that it just needs new pads? The discs (standard) and pads (Mintex 1144) were replaced 18 months/12k miles ago, and 80% of those miles have been motorway miles. It doesn't feel like they should need replacing yet, but "feelings" frequently mislead me!
You will need to check the slide pins are working as they should, the disc could have picked up some of the pad causing a bump on the surface creating the vibration or it could be that your caliper is failing to pull the piston all the way back causing the pad to stay on the disc slightly and over heat. (This is what I had)
To check this when the caliper is removed it shouldn't be super hard to break away from the disc and pads, mine was stuck solid and had to hammer it up and off, the piston was not all the way in.
Warped discs can happen but its not always the disc that's warped, as previously mentioned it can pick up pad material causing the surface problems
Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk
-
- Forum Moderator
- Posts: 2496
- Joined: Wed May 17, 2017 12:27 pm
- RX-8: 231
- Colour: Sunlight Silver
- Location: Tyne & Wear
- Has thanked: 150 times
- Been thanked: 162 times
Re: Front Brake Vibration
As above number of likely causes.
Sticking caliper or slider (Mine gave vibration only at speed and only once warm, could move freely cold but replacement calliper sorted)
Wheel Balance - recent case of this.
Warped disk
tyre pressures/damaged tyre/wheel.
Sticking caliper or slider (Mine gave vibration only at speed and only once warm, could move freely cold but replacement calliper sorted)
Wheel Balance - recent case of this.
Warped disk
tyre pressures/damaged tyre/wheel.
Sunlight Silver 231
Pete/Peter him/he/hrh couldn't really care as have 3 siblings and was lucky not to get called by the dogs name.
Living with a rotary - 7 Years in
viewtopic.php?p=1105043#p1105043
Pete/Peter him/he/hrh couldn't really care as have 3 siblings and was lucky not to get called by the dogs name.
Living with a rotary - 7 Years in
viewtopic.php?p=1105043#p1105043
-
- Former Member
- Posts: 327
- Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2016 9:57 pm
- RX-8: 231
- Colour: Stormy Blue
- Location: London
- Has thanked: 3 times
- Been thanked: 22 times
Re: Front Brake Vibration
Thanks, folks. You have helped me to make one decision: I'm currently visiting Ipswich and I was wondering whether to take it to a (perfectly reasonable) normal garage with some urgency, or whether to book in with The Performance Shop later this week after I return to London, driving carefully in the mean time. I have selected the latter. Over the phone, Rhys described how they would tackle the situation and that they would get discs and pads in just-in-case which could be returned if not needed. I do appreciate the level of service I get there.
-
- Former Member
- Posts: 327
- Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2016 9:57 pm
- RX-8: 231
- Colour: Stormy Blue
- Location: London
- Has thanked: 3 times
- Been thanked: 22 times
Re: Front Brake Vibration
PS: I would have liked to attempt tackle this myself, but I simply do not have the time - or a driveway - at the moment!
-
- Former Member
- Posts: 1968
- Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2018 12:47 pm
- Location: south east London
- Has thanked: 38 times
- Been thanked: 116 times
Re: Front Brake Vibration
I have front calipers refurbished new brembo pads and new disk you can have for 150 collected Se3 Kidbroke Greenwich
LEXUS LS430 4.3 v8 family car
Done exhaust and work wheels
Mx5 nd soul red Mike daily and work horse
Jessy’s Jaguar xkr 4.2 supercharged for fun family days
Done exhaust and work wheels
Mx5 nd soul red Mike daily and work horse
Jessy’s Jaguar xkr 4.2 supercharged for fun family days
-
- Club Member
- Posts: 28317
- Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2006 10:04 pm
- Location: Cheltenham
- Has thanked: 2572 times
- Been thanked: 940 times
Re: Front Brake Vibration
Hopefully a deglaze of the discs and pad surfaces will sort the issue. The 1144 pads do like a bit of hard use which unless you are late braking on Mway slip roads they probably haven’t had and may have glazed.
Rotary History;
Sep 2005-Aug 2006 EO55 XOL VR 231 New
Oct 2014-Mar 2019 OE06 EWJ VR 231
Jan 2019-Jun 2020 T200 CAD Orange SC 231
Feb 2020-May 2023 RR54 AJR VR 231 Modified for Track
Oct 2020-Mar 2021 YA56 EUE Copper Red Nemesis
Jun 2022-Apr 2023 TN07 JHD KURO Resurrected
Jun 2023-Jan2024 OV09 BFF Sparkling Black
Sep 2005-Aug 2006 EO55 XOL VR 231 New
Oct 2014-Mar 2019 OE06 EWJ VR 231
Jan 2019-Jun 2020 T200 CAD Orange SC 231
Feb 2020-May 2023 RR54 AJR VR 231 Modified for Track
Oct 2020-Mar 2021 YA56 EUE Copper Red Nemesis
Jun 2022-Apr 2023 TN07 JHD KURO Resurrected
Jun 2023-Jan2024 OV09 BFF Sparkling Black
-
- Former Member
- Posts: 327
- Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2016 9:57 pm
- RX-8: 231
- Colour: Stormy Blue
- Location: London
- Has thanked: 3 times
- Been thanked: 22 times
Re: Front Brake Vibration
Much appreciated. I'm hoping my calipers are fine - I refurbished mine a couple of years ago too - so I probably won't take you up on this. But thanks anyway.
I didn't mention that much of the 20% of the time that I'm not on the motorway I do give the brakes (and the car in general!) a decent bit of exercise .ChrisHolmes wrote: ↑Fri May 07, 2021 11:38 amHopefully a deglaze of the discs and pad surfaces will sort the issue. The 1144 pads do like a bit of hard use which unless you are late braking on Mway slip roads they probably haven’t had and may have glazed.
Well, come to think of it, maybe since moving to London this is not the case as much as it used to be... No frequent excursions along country lanes so, besides the rapid deceleration caused by odd person drifting out in front of me on the motorway without looking, perhaps I do need to think about giving them more of a workout.
-
- Spin Doctor
- Posts: 32582
- Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2008 10:56 pm
- RX-8: 231
- Colour: Lightning Yellow
- Location: Groomsport, Co Down, NI
- Has thanked: 442 times
- Been thanked: 2086 times
Re: Front Brake Vibration
Have a close inspection of the tyres, including the inner side walls.
Tyres are often a cause of vibration and if a tyre has been damaged, such as impact resulting in de-lamination of the structure, then this can reduce the effective rolling diameter, whether or not the inflation pressure has also dropped.
Any reduction of rolling diameter will cause the wheel to "overspeed" in comparison with the others and can trigger (or suppress) the ABS and/or DSC.
While some of the potential causes given above are probably more likely, tyre damage is easy to check, while unchecked it could result in catastrophic failure.
I had this scenario driving a Vauxhall Astra company car back in the early '80s.
No ABS on that car but the vibration did feel like the brakes, having started about 5 miles after driving over a toppled traffic cone in a motorway contraflow. By the time we pulled into the services and took a look underneath, there was a lump the size of half a big Easter egg on the inside side wall of the front tyre, which had been hitting the suspension upright every rotation
Tyres are often a cause of vibration and if a tyre has been damaged, such as impact resulting in de-lamination of the structure, then this can reduce the effective rolling diameter, whether or not the inflation pressure has also dropped.
Any reduction of rolling diameter will cause the wheel to "overspeed" in comparison with the others and can trigger (or suppress) the ABS and/or DSC.
While some of the potential causes given above are probably more likely, tyre damage is easy to check, while unchecked it could result in catastrophic failure.
I had this scenario driving a Vauxhall Astra company car back in the early '80s.
No ABS on that car but the vibration did feel like the brakes, having started about 5 miles after driving over a toppled traffic cone in a motorway contraflow. By the time we pulled into the services and took a look underneath, there was a lump the size of half a big Easter egg on the inside side wall of the front tyre, which had been hitting the suspension upright every rotation
-
- Forum Moderator
- Posts: 9152
- Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2017 4:56 pm
- RX-8: Turbo
- Colour: Nordic Green
- Location: cornwall
- Has thanked: 100 times
- Been thanked: 544 times
Re: Front Brake Vibration
my record was a tyre on a lorry that looked very much like this
funnily enough, i deflated it and called a tyre fitter
funnily enough, i deflated it and called a tyre fitter
- These users thanked the author qwakers for the post (total 2):
- warpc0il (Fri May 07, 2021 5:37 pm) • Milos_Balunovic (Sun Oct 31, 2021 3:34 pm)
-
- Former Member
- Posts: 327
- Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2016 9:57 pm
- RX-8: 231
- Colour: Stormy Blue
- Location: London
- Has thanked: 3 times
- Been thanked: 22 times
Re: Front Brake Vibration
Thanks for the advice. I'm about to embark on my return journey to London. I will check carefully first!
-
- Club Member
- Posts: 507
- Joined: Fri Mar 23, 2018 3:05 pm
- RX-8: Kuro
- Colour: Sparkling Black
- Location: Hurst Green, East Sussex
- Has thanked: 86 times
- Been thanked: 38 times
Re: Front Brake Vibration
Yesterday going to Birmingham from East Sussex in the van. As soon as I got to 70mph for the first time, I was sure I felt a very subtle new judder.
After a couple of hours on the M40 it got less subtle and after 2 mins I decided that I had either lost a wheel weight or maybe some nuts had come loose. But I now felt like it was coming from the rear. It was hammering with rain but decided to quickly pull up on the hard shoulder and check the nuts quickly as I had a socket set in the back. Nipped them all up but they were fine. Set off again. Within 1 mile had a blow out at 70. Must have been a bulge on the inner shoulder that I couldn't see.
Had a spare tyre. Did not have a jack...... Not a fun day. Lesson learnt.
After a couple of hours on the M40 it got less subtle and after 2 mins I decided that I had either lost a wheel weight or maybe some nuts had come loose. But I now felt like it was coming from the rear. It was hammering with rain but decided to quickly pull up on the hard shoulder and check the nuts quickly as I had a socket set in the back. Nipped them all up but they were fine. Set off again. Within 1 mile had a blow out at 70. Must have been a bulge on the inner shoulder that I couldn't see.
Had a spare tyre. Did not have a jack...... Not a fun day. Lesson learnt.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Kuro 174/500.
RRP midpipe (single resonator) w/ Pettit/Milltek cat-back, RRP MK2 Coils and MSD leads, AEM Cold Air Intake, RRP Custom Map, Royal Steering Wheels custom wheel. Mazdaspeed bodykit, Team Dynamics Pro Race 1.2s, Smoked LED rear lights, Stoney Racing Hose Kit, Lots of red in the engine bay.
#174’s journey: viewtopic.php?f=104&t=78506
RRP midpipe (single resonator) w/ Pettit/Milltek cat-back, RRP MK2 Coils and MSD leads, AEM Cold Air Intake, RRP Custom Map, Royal Steering Wheels custom wheel. Mazdaspeed bodykit, Team Dynamics Pro Race 1.2s, Smoked LED rear lights, Stoney Racing Hose Kit, Lots of red in the engine bay.
#174’s journey: viewtopic.php?f=104&t=78506
-
- Spin Doctor
- Posts: 32582
- Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2008 10:56 pm
- RX-8: 231
- Colour: Lightning Yellow
- Location: Groomsport, Co Down, NI
- Has thanked: 442 times
- Been thanked: 2086 times
Re: Front Brake Vibration
I suspect you'd picked-up a piece of metal in the tread, that was hiding when you checked the first time.
Must have been a moment
Must have been a moment
-
- Events Team Member
- Posts: 12602
- Joined: Sun Jun 27, 2004 7:14 pm
- RX-8: 231
- Colour: Titanium Grey
- Location: Colchester
- Has thanked: 507 times
- Been thanked: 451 times
Re: Front Brake Vibration
That's a spectacular blowout!
Essex Rotary Full Bridgeport
Seibon Carbon Fibre Bonnet, "Racing Brake" front calipers, Racing Beat (RB) ARB's F&R, RB REVI intake, full RB Stainless Steel Exhaust & Mani, 20mm Eibach spacers, KOYO Ali Rad, Lightened Fly, Tein MonoFlex coilovers & strut brace, Axial short-shifter, BHR Coils & Engine Mounts, Greddy Sump
Federal 595RS-R or Rainsport 3
Seibon Carbon Fibre Bonnet, "Racing Brake" front calipers, Racing Beat (RB) ARB's F&R, RB REVI intake, full RB Stainless Steel Exhaust & Mani, 20mm Eibach spacers, KOYO Ali Rad, Lightened Fly, Tein MonoFlex coilovers & strut brace, Axial short-shifter, BHR Coils & Engine Mounts, Greddy Sump
Federal 595RS-R or Rainsport 3
-
- Club Member
- Posts: 8037
- Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2014 9:11 pm
- RX-8: 40th Anniversary
- Colour: Crystal White
- Location: poole dorset
- Has thanked: 742 times
- Been thanked: 284 times
Re: Front Brake Vibration
Didn't realise remoulds were still available
Sent from my VOG-L29 using Tapatalk
Sent from my VOG-L29 using Tapatalk
Hayward's Street/bridgeported rebuild,595's,Tein coilovers edfc Racingbeat rear anti roll bar oil pres oil temp gauge pod's,lockwood front rear grills,Tinted wind ws folding tow hook's,595s,connect2 ,at long last sohn and ap50 tank instaled ,revi ram air duct already fitted ! calipers painted,diff oil changed .
just oil lines to fit at some stage ( had them a while too)
180 of 400
just oil lines to fit at some stage ( had them a while too)
180 of 400
-
- Former Member
- Posts: 327
- Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2016 9:57 pm
- RX-8: 231
- Colour: Stormy Blue
- Location: London
- Has thanked: 3 times
- Been thanked: 22 times
Re: Front Brake Vibration
A quick update. Last week I took the car to TPS and they thoroughly dismantled, cleaned and greased all four brakes. There was still plenty of life in the pads and discs and no apparent warping. However, on reassembly, the vibrations still existed. So, by a process of elimination, the front discs and pads were changed and this solved the vibration problem. This is a bit of a shame because I had not even had a chance to take the Mintex 1144s (bought through the club) on the track yet. Well, they're still on the rears, but hey. My fronts are now running Yellow Stuff which are also supposed to be good on the track.
All this done, I was a little bit disappointed when the ABS and TCS lights came on a few days later! They have not been coming on each trip, as before, so something has improved. However, they came on after a slightly sharp application of the breaks which ended in a characteristic but brief "squelch" from the ABS. My opinion is that the ABS wouldn't normally have triggered then, but there might have been something slimy or loose was on the road. In any case, something still isn't quite right. I'll keep my eyes on the situation and perhaps find a safe place to investigate properly.
All this done, I was a little bit disappointed when the ABS and TCS lights came on a few days later! They have not been coming on each trip, as before, so something has improved. However, they came on after a slightly sharp application of the breaks which ended in a characteristic but brief "squelch" from the ABS. My opinion is that the ABS wouldn't normally have triggered then, but there might have been something slimy or loose was on the road. In any case, something still isn't quite right. I'll keep my eyes on the situation and perhaps find a safe place to investigate properly.
-
- Former Member
- Posts: 327
- Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2016 9:57 pm
- RX-8: 231
- Colour: Stormy Blue
- Location: London
- Has thanked: 3 times
- Been thanked: 22 times
Re: Front Brake Vibration
I'm resurrecting this thread because I don't think the problem has been solved. I believe that I am starting to feel vibrations again when applying the brakes at speeds above 50mph. (The vibrations are noticeable even with a gradual application of brakes.) The activation of he ABS and TCS lights in the last post had not recurred until last week, so I wonder if the problem might be with the braking mechanism itself and it gets worse as the pads get thinner?
In any case, I will continue to monitor and mention it to TPS when I next take the car in. (Incidentally, I'm running different tyres now. I didn't spot any changes around the time that I changed tyres - all still appeared well.)
In any case, I will continue to monitor and mention it to TPS when I next take the car in. (Incidentally, I'm running different tyres now. I didn't spot any changes around the time that I changed tyres - all still appeared well.)
-
- Former Member
- Posts: 2074
- Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2020 9:46 am
- Has thanked: 0
- Been thanked: 1 time
Re: Front Brake Vibration
Had the same issue, mine was resolved by replacing the front Hubs as the seat between the hub and the disc was not the best due to the faces not being 100%Hopkins wrote: ↑Sun Oct 31, 2021 3:25 pmI'm resurrecting this thread because I don't think the problem has been solved. I believe that I am starting to feel vibrations again when applying the brakes at speeds above 50mph. (The vibrations are noticeable even with a gradual application of brakes.) The activation of he ABS and TCS lights in the last post had not recurred until last week, so I wonder if the problem might be with the braking mechanism itself and it gets worse as the pads get thinner?
In any case, I will continue to monitor and mention it to TPS when I next take the car in. (Incidentally, I'm running different tyres now. I didn't spot any changes around the time that I changed tyres - all still appeared well.)
So new Hubs pads and discs sorted it for me.
-
- Former Member
- Posts: 327
- Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2016 9:57 pm
- RX-8: 231
- Colour: Stormy Blue
- Location: London
- Has thanked: 3 times
- Been thanked: 22 times
Re: Front Brake Vibration
Ah, thanks. I wonder if that will solve the persistently squeaky brakes too?
-
- Spin Doctor
- Posts: 32582
- Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2008 10:56 pm
- RX-8: 231
- Colour: Lightning Yellow
- Location: Groomsport, Co Down, NI
- Has thanked: 442 times
- Been thanked: 2086 times
Re: Front Brake Vibration
I've come across this when people haven't refitted the locating screws on the front discs (because the FB experts say that they're not needed) and dirt/grit/rust has got behind the disc when refitting the wheel.
The face of the disc then doesn't run true to the plane of the hub.
I've also seen where people do fit the locating screws but don't bother to clean the mating surfaces first, which gives the same result.
One of my work colleagues spent £50 getting his discs reground in-situ to "cure" a problem that was only there because of rust he'd left behind the disc.
I'm not suggesting any of these applied in your case and it could have been a damaged hub or failing bearing, but it's always worth checking the easy things first.
-
- Former Member
- Posts: 2074
- Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2020 9:46 am
- Has thanked: 0
- Been thanked: 1 time
Re: Front Brake Vibration
You are spot on, It was dirty faces not allowing a perfect fit, they were cleaned but it was never good enough, life is too short to spend time faffing, easier to just get the parts replaced.warpc0il wrote: ↑Mon Nov 01, 2021 6:22 pmI've come across this when people haven't refitted the locating screws on the front discs (because the FB experts say that they're not needed) and dirt/grit/rust has got behind the disc when refitting the wheel.
The face of the disc then doesn't run true to the plane of the hub.
I've also seen where people do fit the locating screws but don't bother to clean the mating surfaces first, which gives the same result.
One of my work colleagues spent £50 getting his discs reground in-situ to "cure" a problem that was only there because of rust he'd left behind the disc.
I'm not suggesting any of these applied in your case and it could have been a damaged hub or failing bearing, but it's always worth checking the easy things first.
I now know how old all the parts are which will help rule things out in the future and hopefully future proof the car.
-
- Forum Moderator
- Posts: 9152
- Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2017 4:56 pm
- RX-8: Turbo
- Colour: Nordic Green
- Location: cornwall
- Has thanked: 100 times
- Been thanked: 544 times
Re: Front Brake Vibration
when i have that problem, i knock the studs out and use a wire cup brush on a grinder. comes up spotless.
harder to do on the rear as the studs dont come out without dismantling quite a lot iirc.
harder to do on the rear as the studs dont come out without dismantling quite a lot iirc.
-
- Former Member
- Posts: 2074
- Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2020 9:46 am
- Has thanked: 0
- Been thanked: 1 time
Re: Front Brake Vibration
I completely understand your solution, but from what you say it's a problem you have had more than once, presumably repeating the process.
Where we differ is I don't want the problem to come back, at least not until the parts are worn out.
Wishful thinking with these cars I know.
-
- Forum Moderator
- Posts: 9152
- Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2017 4:56 pm
- RX-8: Turbo
- Colour: Nordic Green
- Location: cornwall
- Has thanked: 100 times
- Been thanked: 544 times
Re: Front Brake Vibration
nope, ive just owned a lot of cars over the years and have had to do it on more than one car. once done its a permanent fix. my 'instructions' if you can call them that are specific to the rx8, the problem is not.