Proud R3 Owner

[ChrisHolmes]

and I suggested checking earlier

[craigy85]

Thanks qwakers... I know Chris suggested the same but I understood a faulty ESS would mean no RPM detected? Every time it's failed to start the rev counter and Torque lite have registered RPM (between about 280 and 260).

Also - wouldn't it have thrown an error code?

[craigy85]

The ESS has a couple of different internal failure modes, plus it can also be affected by magnetic debris stuck on the outside.

They can have an issue when left cold and unused for a long time.
This means that it failed the pre-start systems check and the EML says on after the dashboard lamp test.
The engine still spins on the starter but there's no firing. This can be confused for "flooded".
The revcounter won't show starter revs, neither would an ODB2 reader
Checking with a reader should show P0335 or P0336.
The engine won't start until the code is cleared.

They can die when they get hot.
If the "go sick" before dying then the CEL should flash and either a P0300, 0301 or 0302 should be recorded, all of which related to uneven pulses, e.g. misfire.
However, they can just die, in which case it's like just switching the engine off, as all sparks and fuel injector activity stops.
In this case, when you attempt to restart then sometimes the fault is detected by the system check, as above, and sometimes not.
Sometime the engine will sputter but not really run and just die again, while the engine is still hot. This can be confused for "low compression".
Often, if this is the first offence, then the ESS may start working again once it's cooled down, either to repeat as soon as hot again or not for days/weeks later.

Corrosion of the loom connection on the ESS can also create similar symptoms.

What is strange is your engine not starting, despite showing revs in Torque, which doesn't really match either of these scenarios.
I'm not saying the the issue isn't related to the ESS but I'd be looking at other things too.

You mentioned a strong fuel smell, and discounted fuel pump, but have you checked for leaks?
Either around the pump or the fuel rail/injectors?

[craigy85]

Thanks so much for the comprehensive reply Dave! After my last post I was thinking about the ESS again... last night, we tried a normal deflood (didn't work but could smell a strong fuel smell from the exhaust- clearly flooded from my earlier attempts to start), then 2 tow starts (also didn't work). The RAC guy then checked for spark at the coils (all fine) and fuel pump (by noise) before 2 further tow starts (again, didn't work) before towing the car home. Haven't checked for a pump leak - will get the cover off later but no unusual smells prior to yesterday and around the injectors looks pretty clean

[tsouthern]

Update - the exhaust leak turned out to be a small hole in the cat, right next to the rear hanger, so that came off to be repaired.... until I had a look inside

So, that's been replaced with a decat pipe for now and I'll look to pick up a 200 cell cat before the next MOT (and sell on the collapsed cat for scrap)

What brand of decat did you install? Do you know if 190/231 and R3 are the same?


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[craigy85]

What brand of decat did you install? Do you know if 190/231 and R3 are the same?
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It was 2nd hand and unbranded (as far as I could tell) but I believe all cats / decats are the same?

[craigy85]

I've been meaning to post an update on this for the past two weeks as I think I've found the cause of my breakdown.... a faulty fuel guage!

I'd neglected to mention I put two 5l cans of fresh fuel into the tank the morning after the breakdown, after checking for a spark and turning the engine over by hand (to listen for signs of compression)... I was concerned that the cataclean could have done something, so thought fresh fuel would help to dilute it. After running the car for about 15 miles I went to fill her up and she took around 60 litres (so by my calcs she must have been bone dry)! Have kept the tank topped up and shes run perfectly since...

The gauge was showing around 1/8 of a tank and had no low fuel light on when she broke down... im now carrying 5l of petrol in the boot and planning to run the tank down again to see when she runs out.

I've also had another compression test done and shes now showing 6.0, 6.3, 6.4 on the front, 6.8 across the board on the rear, so the decat, cataclean and Italian tune up seems to have worked wonders... and that's within 600 miles of the first test, so hopefully there's still some improvement to come!

[nightfire10]

Have you never seen the fuel low light? You've not lived on the edge then

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[craigy85]

Have you never seen the fuel low light? You've not lived on the edge then

Nope - bought the car with a full tank of fuel and filled back up when it got to about 1/2 a tank (in preparation for the long drive home) - this was the first time in my ownership it had been under 1/4 of a tank.

[New Duke]

Have you never seen the fuel low light? You've not lived on the edge then

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Getting to 30 miles into the fuel low light being on.

THAT's clench time

I went to fill her up and she took around 60 litres (so by my calcs she must have been bone dry)!

Nah, you had another 4-5 litres of fuel left. Loads.

Not sure I'd regularly keep petrol in the boot, sat where the diff gets it nice and hot or it could spill in a big accident. I'm sure you'll be fine buuuuuut....

[craigy85]

I went to fill her up and she took around 60 litres (so by my calcs she must have been bone dry)!

Nah, you had another 4-5 litres of fuel left. Loads.

I'd already added 10 litres from the cans and driven for about 15 -20 miles though....

[craigy85]

Faulty fuel gauge confirmed - she ran out of petrol again tonight after 270 miles (and still showing just under 1/4 tank)... Put the 5 litres in from the can in the boot and she fired straight up, so I drove to the nearest garage where it took another 62.5l to brim the tank!

[New Duke]

Do you know what's involved in replacing the fuel gauge? I've not heard of one failing before so have no idea myself. Is it just a float in the tank?

[craigy85]

Seems to be commonly reported on the US forums... looks like the float / sender is accessed by taking out the fuel pump. check for resistance at top and bottom of the float range and replace if out of spec / bent. I suppose it could simply be catching on something inside the tank? Will have to have a look but it'll probably be a job for another day / month / year... at least I now know roughly where it runs out so can just keep the tank above 1/4 and hopefully no more breakdowns

[Ainmhidh]

With the various issues we've seen reported from the S1 fuel tank recall, it's possible that some part of the sender has become detached from the tank?

[New Duke]

With the various issues we've seen reported from the S1 fuel tank recall, it's possible that some part of the sender has become detached from the tank?

Maybe the sender be casually floating in the tank and be like "YO... WUT?"

Sender.jpg

[*thomas*]

Sorry to bump your thread, but was wondering if you ever fitted the B12 suspension setup and what it looks like? I'm debating about getting.

Great looking car btw, there's just something 'magic' about an R3 .

[craigy85]

Hi Thomas, Sorry for the late reply, and for bumping the thread again... completely missed your message! I did fit the B12 kit and find it superb... a tiny bit firmer than stock but not harsh at all, and cornering is definitely improved - I also love the look!

Unfortunately, after spending a fortune on her over the past 2 years, I'm now having to consider selling up... we've just had a new arrival (baby boy) and I can no longer fit the family in the RX8