231 engine into a 192

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Secla
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231 engine into a 192

Post by Secla »

How much work is it to swap a 231 into a 192 ?

I’m guessing most of it’s electrical, I know most will say just buy a 231 but i currently have a 192 I purchased on the cheap. I’m sure it will need a rebuild at some point.

Also seen that Ryan rotary has done some work with the 192 and would like to see some direct comparison with there tuned 192 vs stock 231
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by Boston Rotary »

Ecu swap clocks engine plus loom. Gearbox if you want too. Easy job
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231 engine into a 192

Post by Neilparry »

Not as much as I thought apparently. Talked to Mark (dern) today who has a previously and successful achieved this task.

231 Engine, wiring harness and 231 ecu. 231 clocks and the six speed box to get your speedo ratio correct.

Obviously central locking won’t work unless you change the body controller, and probably a few other bits and bobs.

Easy peasie

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Boston Rotary (Sat Sep 14, 2019 8:21 pm)
:wash:
Secla
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by Secla »

Simpler than I thought then.
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by warpc0il »

Plus front O2 exhaust sensor.

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Boston Rotary (Sat Sep 14, 2019 9:44 pm)
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by mi60o0 »

192 isn't that slower than 231 standard
I have non ported 192 tuned and few bits
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by mi60o0 »

Search horsham dyno day all result are from 231
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by Paul_13 »

From experience I would put the 6 speed box in to match the engine. I really didn't agree with a 5 speed box on the 231 engine. *but I'm running a 3.7/9 diff (mx5 nc) *
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by dern »

Before you do this check your insurance as it's quite a modification in terms of a power hike.
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by warpc0il »

We had a member a few years ago drop an unmodified 192 into his 231, just because his 231 had died and the 192 lump was going cheap.

He contacted his insurer, hoping for a reduction, and was told there would be a 40% increase.

Their logic being that he hadn't converted the 231 model into the lower-band 192 but he had made "significant modification" - despite it making less power.

Having declared the mod, many companies refused to even quote.

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I was trying to find the original thread but it must have gone quiet for too long and been deleted by housekeeping.
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by Secla »

Yeh I hadn’t thought of the insurance aspect
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by Juey »

bigpete wrote:
Sat Sep 14, 2019 7:37 pm
Ecu swap clocks engine plus loom. Gearbox if you want too. Easy job
...that's not what you said last year :lol: :P
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Boston Rotary (Thu Sep 26, 2019 4:24 pm)
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by Adrian Flux »

Secla wrote:
Wed Sep 25, 2019 5:02 pm
Yeh I hadn’t thought of the insurance aspect
Hi.
If you need any help with insurance at all then please feel free to drop me a line.
Regards,
Dan.
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by warpc0il »

Hi Dan, it's good to see that search.php?keywords=Insurance still works ;)
Or do you Google [site:https://www.rx8ownersclub.co.uk/forum insurance]?
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by Calcifur83 »

I see this is an old thread but I am interested in the potential of swapping a 192 engine and gear box into a 231 chassis. The reason for this is that 231s are way more common than the 192 and I have a nice 192 street ported that I want to keep. My chassis is rotting though. The initial plan between myself and my Step-Dad was to get a Nemesis and swap it onto that. However now we have the Nemesis he quite likes it and has called dibs on it for his 'retirement project' given he paid for it, I guess I can't complain too much. I have found a 231 near me wth poor compression that this up for £350. I am very tempted by it to use as a chassis for my 192 project.
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by Boston Rotary »

Do it, you have everything you need from the donor car to go in the 231 so no problems
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by Calcifur83 »

I like your enthusiasm. I also like the idea that it gives me a spare engine to play with to learn to strip and build on. I there a 13b Renisis workshop manual somewhere on this forum?

Edit\:

found the interactive manuals thread!
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Boston Rotary (Sun Jun 14, 2020 6:01 pm)
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by Calcifur83 »

Would there be any benefit to putting the 6speed gearbox with the 192 engine, or is that just a mistake?

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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by mi60o0 »

I have 6speed on my 192 due I had dead clutch and I had spare box from my old rx8 and Chris sold me nearly new clutch and good fly wheel so I went for 6 speed conversion
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by Calcifur83 »

was there a benefit to doing it, or just because it was convenient?
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by mi60o0 »

Calcifur83 wrote:
Sun Jun 14, 2020 6:49 pm
was there a benefit to doing it, or just because it was convenient?
I have no idea as I haven't driven the 5 speed box for more than 50 miles.
My car is been on rotary revs hub dyno result was good for 192
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by warpc0il »

Make a quick phone call to your insurers, as last time someone was planning to go in this direction they discovered that the combination would cost them 30% more to insure than a standard 231, which was already more than a 192.

This may sound bizarre but insurance companies only work on "standard" or "modified" and putting the engine from a different model (even though it's got less power) they see as a significant modification, and up the premium (or refuse cover).

The final car will also be worth less, if/when you come to sell, than either a standard 231 or 192, partly due to the insurance issue and also due to "Why?".
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by Calcifur83 »

the final value doesn't really matter, I would just break it up again. I can have a look around for insurance if I decide to go down this rabbit hole. But it is worth bearing in mind.
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by Calcifur83 »

mi60o0 wrote:
Sun Jun 14, 2020 6:55 pm
Calcifur83 wrote:
Sun Jun 14, 2020 6:49 pm
was there a benefit to doing it, or just because it was convenient?
I have no idea as I haven't driven the 5 speed box for more than 50 miles.
My car is been on rotary revs hub dyno result was good for 192
was wondering if the different gearing might have given better performance of some kind or at least having a sixth gear might return better mpg.
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Re: 231 engine into a 192

Post by Honkytonk »

From memory of when this topic has come up before, there's very little in it. I think the final ratios are actually close enough to make little difference at top gear cruising speeds. I do remember a graph knocking about the forum at some point that showed the comparison between the two ratios but bugger me if I can find it right now.

I did find this on the yankee forum;

High power unit:
1st: 3.760
2nd: 2.269
3rd: 1.539
4th: 1.187
5th: 1.000
6th: 0.843
Reverse: 3.564
Final: 4.444

Standard power 5 speed:
1st: 3.483
2nd: 2.015
3rd: 1.391
4th: 1.000
5th: 0.806
6th: -------
Reverse: 3.288
Final: 4.300

But yank forum, so pinch of salt required. I would imagine the american boxes and ours are very similar though, seems very uncorporate to build completely different gearbox ratios for the UK market, even though we got loads of extra goodies as standard.

Edit; If true, I think the only major thing you'd actually notice when driving is an extra intermediate step in the ratios midway between what would be 2nd and 3rd in the 5 speed when you have the 6 speed one (I can attest to that feeling right having driven plenty of both 5 and 6 speeds, although admittedly a while back and not for huge distances, that's where the 8's magic comes alive on most normal roads after all)
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