Annual Meet 2025 - 20th-21st Sept - Snowdonia and Colwyn Bay

[DrewR3]

The attendance at events this year has been terrible with the sole exception of the Bicester Heritage event.

Myself included in the terrible attendance.

Not one for this thread specifically, but perhaps a discussion thread discussing why may be of benefit...?

Distance is certainly a challenge with the snowdon run, sure, but attendance to other meets etc. have been down the whole year...

Distance is irrelevant, if you truly wish to do something. Many people have completed the NC500, which was also a club event/AM one year, It is what was listed and if you wanted to do it, you signed up. The NC500 isn't going to move, its at the top of the UK and staying there. Unfortunately unless we do the same things time in and time out, in the same area, then we have to all share a burden of travel to do different and new things. Other examples of the Nurburgring and RotorStock, both on the continent are regularly attended by members and car enthusiasts. I know Neil and Harry are heading out there from Yorkshirefor the next one!

I appreciate people would find certain distances to far for their own personal circumstances, and that is fine. You cant do everything. Those that have gone thats not for me this year and passed on by, fair enough. But there is no need for constant commenting aimed at nothing more than the detriement of the club. On something the club is trying to do for members (and im not singling the one comment above out, i am referring in general), to purposely put a negative spin on a positive event. Its unnecessary and disruptive to the clubs goals and trying to increase attendance. As I said above, this club will likely just become JDM Combe and the south fish and chip run, as it drives away members from other areas and becomes divisive.....again. We have already lost so many Scottish and Northern members because everything is aimed at the south and the north is not supported. For just 1 event this year, which isn't even that north, it would of been nice to get some support and not abuse from the members that have everything usually on their doorstep. Didn't even need to be signing up for it, but the simple comments of "i can't make this year but thats a great looking trip and good for the club" would of made the difference in us as a community supporting eachother and the efforts of everyone trying to keep the club going for all members. We are losing our way, and our members, to the likes of familia and other clubs that do various and exciting things all over the UK.

As for your attendance question. Ive got feedback from various people through the year, this includes:

Ironically distance to our events/the same events/that they primarily are in the south, the same events calendar that people are bored of, lack of variety of events or not wanting to do shows (though I did convince one person with that view into 2 shows this year they enjoyed in the end). I have tried to push that, though we are a Japanese car, we can do multi platforms rather than just Japanese shows and then on the other end of the above, too much choice of events. Then the usual concerns of costs, personal circumstances/sickness/injury, cost of living and the car being off the road to save money or for repair. Add them all together and unfortunately we have low attendance at many events and such a scatter of reasoning that there is no easy fix to any of the above to increase attandance. Other than trying to change variety, location and activity.

[DrewR3]

This event is within reasonable reach from Liverpool, Manchester, Sheffield, Leeds, York, Nottingham, Birmingham and other large Midland and Northern cities. It disappointing is to see so few members from those areas supporting this AM.

When we held an AM in Wigan, just prior to the pandemic, it was noticeable that the vast majority of attendees came large distances from the south, with very few "northern" attendees.

I agree, with the exception of Castle Combe and Bicester, attendance at events has been down on previous years but I would ask the committee to seriously consider why we consistently seem to have such poor attendance at events in "northern" locations.

[Ouzify]

I think one potential reason could be that they aren’t done often enough up north for people to build a relationship with other members of the club.
If we are only doing one event up north, it reduces the likelihood of having attendance due to clashes with things in peoples personal lives, and in turn that reduces the chance of people meeting others from up north and building the relationships to attend more events.

I personally had no plans to attend any events this year due to not really knowing anyone, until I happened to be close to Drew and help him with his car, and he encouraged me to attend events

It’s very much a catch 22 situation that with a limited amount of meets in the north, you won’t generate much interest, which makes you not want to organise events up there

[DrewR3]

This event is within reasonable reach from Liverpool, Manchester, Sheffield, Leeds, York, Nottingham, Birmingham and other large Midland and Northern cities. It disappointing is to see so few members from those areas supporting this AM.

When we held an AM in Wigan, just prior to the pandemic, it was noticeable that the vast majority of attendees came large distances from the south, with very few "northern" attendees.

I agree, with the exception of Castle Combe and Bicester, attendance at events has been down on previous years but I would ask the committee to seriously consider why we consistently seem to have such poor attendance at events in "northern" locations.

But the issue has been noted I think by Ouzify above, we have lost the members up here from not providing for them. And I appreciate that people once a year like that wigan AM may have to travel, but otherwise you never experience anything new. I am currently going to plan a Nurburgring trip, away from the club as a private venture, which involves me driving from North Wales well beyond the south. But it is an experience I want to do, as before the Nurburgring wont move to me. The Welsh mountains wont move to the south and nor will the Scottish Highlands.

If your content that the club becomes a fish and chip monthly meet and a few M4 corridor events with an online forum, and only southern membership and southern events, then that's the direction its going. I've tried to steer the club away from that and keep its UK status, but my tenure is at an end and there will always be other options or clubs for people to attend other functions with around the country and internationally. Which unfortunately is where they will go and not here. It may be a foreshadowing message, but unless this is rectified or the mentality of some in here changes, then the clubs future will be grave.

[DrewR3]

There’s many an event I can’t attend due to either logistics or financial commitments, but I sure won’t moan about it.
Life is life, it gets in the way of everything

It’s a bit late in the season but I know a handful of events that are ran around the North Lincs area but they’re not “jap only” which I feel like is the MO of what the clubs “main” events are.

Even my “local” event is Worksop, and as my only mode of transport is the 8 which is like an old workhorse limping to the glue factory, it is irresponsible of me to commit to these minor, usually a work night, events, but I don’t take an issue with them, it is what it is.

Everyone has a list of vetos and it is, and always will be impossible to cater for everyone. Stomping feet and badmouthing will never change that.

[DrewR3]

I would also add that using the metric of
“More southern members show up than northern” in raw numbers isn’t fair, there’s vastly more southern members in the first place

[cabbageboi28]

It would be interesting if we could map out members (like on an actual map) and then work out from that which meets locations would be best and stuff

[DrewR3]

It would be interesting if we could map out members (like on an actual map) and then work out from that which meets locations would be best and stuff

There is a member heat map which shows everyone's location. It may be a committee tool, not sure....

[ChrisHolmes]

I’ll cook one up tomorrow based on current membership

[ChrisHolmes]

The last time I dared comment on here about a previous Snowdonia drive, now “the” AM I was met with rebuttal and committee member wrath.
Looking back though this current event topic it was obvious ages ago the event was not going to fly yet the dead horse was continued to be flogged.
What is abundantly clear is that the club is in trouble organisationally and possibly financially but as a former member I don’t know how the club finances have fairer over the past couple of years. Hopefully whoever replaces Drew as the new chairman will be able to garner some enthusiasm for events amongst the members.

[HarSc]

Hi Chris

you're back! It's "bash Drew" time again!




sips tea

grabs popcorn

[Dr. FrankenRex]

Hopefully whoever replaces Drew as the new chairman will be able to garner some enthusiasm for events amongst the members.

I'm not sure how the chairman alone is ultimately responsible, or able to 'fix' poor attendance at events

[ChrisHolmes]

You always seem to misinterpret what I post Dan. I was not referring to Drew’s performance but saying how I hoped his successor would perform.

[ChrisHolmes]

Hi Chris

you're back! It's "bash Drew" time again!




sips tea

grabs popcorn

Not really Harry, more wishing the next chairman can create more interest in activities.

[ChrisHolmes]

Time you joined again Chris

[ChrisHolmes]

Thanks, but no thanks Pete

[DrewR3]

The last time I dared comment on here about a previous Snowdonia drive, now “the” AM I was met with rebuttal and committee member wrath.
Looking back though this current event topic it was obvious ages ago the event was not going to fly yet the dead horse was continued to be flogged.
What is abundantly clear is that the club is in trouble organisationally and possibly financially but as a former member I don’t know how the club finances have fairer over the past couple of years. Hopefully whoever replaces Drew as the new chairman will be able to garner some enthusiasm for events amongst the members.

Welcome back Chris. It just wasn't the same being Chairman without you. Your comments and discussion are always welcome.

It is "the" AM because it was voted to be by the membership, you may not have seen that topic as it was in the members area to discuss and select the AM after your lapse i am afraid.

This was set democratically and the "flogging" has been as always to try and encourage maximum attendance in order to fulfil the will of the majority and to hold an AM, as we do every year.

To set your mind at ease, the club is not in any organisational or financial difficulty, it is in an anyone participating in anything difficulty. Luckily we have a robust treasurer who works in the financial sector and is abundantly over qualified for the role.

Indeed the new Chairman does need to rally enthusiasm and increase attendance at events, for that we can agree and is why I am standing aside. After years of countless and thankless hours of work every week behind the scenes with policy reviews, PMs, disciplinary, bickering, club running, gentle team nudges to keep things on track, many many ideas of things for us to do and improve, show sign offs, ensuring a robust committee are in place at all times and generally trying to keep the club afloat. I look forward to handing over.

And, I absolutely endorse and as current chair waive the 12 months membership requirement for you to stand if you would like? Given your long history with the club and the years of contribution and previous time on the CM, i would be happy to endorse your life membership as my parting gift to you as you narrowly missed it with time served in your last tenure and allow you to stand, if you would still like to. With a strong committee currently. Now is the ideal time to take the reigns. And the club needs a chair to continue. As the last candidate to stand, perhaps you would once again?

[ChrisHolmes]

You always seem to misinterpret what I post Dan. I was not referring to Drew’s performance but saying how I hoped his successor would perform.

But my question still stands. How is one person, albeit the chair of the club, going to fix it...?

[ChrisHolmes]

If you don’t know Dan then you had best not stand for Chairman.

[Red & Black]

Too costly, too far! The annual meet should have been central to country, Yakushi 2023 was proof of that. I've organised a meet and drive on the Suffolk Coast this weekend, I don't see any interest from the west side of the country?

It is not those for everyone and once again i am fed up with people tainting the AM because of their own negative views and opionions. Which is why i will no longer be Chairman of this club. It has been adapted to suit all budgets, unfortunately i cannot change the distance from personal locations. It was actually democratically voted upon, unlike every other AM. The AM is vastly different to a generic meet. Yakushi was actually a flop this year with 3 or 4 people, so your arguement of centrality is flawed. The AM has always moved around the country to keep variety, from up near Hull for a trackday, to south coast for Beulieu to central for yakushi and camping for the last 3 to name a few.

The key to an AM is variety of event, the key to club longevity is variety. Not everything can be on the doorstep of the few who expect everything to be conducted on the m4 or m40 corridor for their convenience. I have to travel a 600 mile round-trip for nearly every show (Beaulieu and goodwood were 700 miles each this year), yet do not complain to Beulieu they need to move the show, nor do I hear rhetoric like this from the Scottish members, the northern Yorkshire members or the far eastern members who travel nearly all the time large distances for everything.

The Snowdon trip is primarily a well attended road trip, with one year having over 20 members plus partners in attendance which in its own right is close or beyond normal AM numbers. It was voted on and a popular road trip. I will say I wont be running it again for the OC, so if anyone does wish to experience this, they may wish to sign up. The accommodation has changed to suit your own budget and there is no cost to take part other than fuel. In comparison to other AMs from the past 20 years, there is no £100 plus track day cost, there is no specific hotel at £200 plus now specified as per the last ones which were more costly than this hotel as they were in the south, there is no £50 plus entry cost into a show. So actual, this is not a "costly" option. It is actually likely the cheapest option for both members and the club.

Perhaps the next chairman will be south easterly and this club can become the southern RX8 OC that it is currently looking destined to become, while it excludes every other member from around the country, which will result in the clubs demise with such narrow mindedness to not think of others that are not all located in the south. (Yakushi is also not central to the UK. It is south near Oxford). We actually attempted to make an event in a truly central position to the country earlier this year as an AM.....that went well and had no uptake. Actually alot less the the current AMs interest from club members.

If people do not wish to attend this AM, then simply do not. Do not try and taint it for others. It was set to be well attended, but unfortunately there has been significant health or personal situations which have resulted in members directly contacting me with their apologies for removal. Or are we now going to target people for serious illness and road traffic accidents? It remains open and the committee remain conducting their duties to promote it.

Also the chairman nominations are open, if anyone wishes to be nominated as I will not be continuing for reasons like above, then ensure you get nominations in please. The club fundamentally and constitutionally require a Chairman and treasurer to exist. Otherwise it will cease as per the constitution. I look forward to seeing the direction this club is to be taken in. Thank you.

I'm certainly not, and I'm sure others are not trying to "taint" this event or undermined your ability as club chairman. I'm purely trying to state the obvious, that the meet attendancees are on a downward spiral and "bumping" has very little effect at this late stage. If what I read is right, you currently have 8 confirmed for the AM. So what can you take from the democratic vote, where 17 thought Snowdon would be best suited? Ticking a box is one thing, doing something about it is another! I ticked Yakushi, along with 3 others, and contrary to your "guess" we had 7 RX8s. Only one less than the confirmed number to the AM! Whittlebury Park next to Silverstone host Yakushi, which is an hour away from Oxford! If you include the west country, I would argue that it was pretty central and doable from most parts of the England and Wales in a day. In 2023 at Yakushi, I spoke to a couple who were doing a round trip from the Lake District to be at the event.

Since joining the club 3 years ago I've supported the RX8OC at many events. Last year, not only did I do the Double Header... Castle Combe and Beaulieu. I attended Yakushi on the Saturday and Go Japan @ Brands on the Sunday. I was too, the only member to represent the club at the Classic Japfest down @ Goodwood. Adding to that, I did the Japfest @ Silverstone, the Peak District Drive, and I organised a successful Forest Drive through Thetford Forest.
This year I've attended the AGM @ Shuttleworth. The poor turn out at Beaulieu, where only 2 of the RX8s were club members! The very enjoyable Cotswold Drive. I would have been at Castle Combe, but the engine light came on the night before and I had no time to check what was at fault. I'm heading down to the Japanese Day @ Brooklands next weekend. Locally I've organised the Suffolk Costal Drive for this weekend and earlier in the year I hosted a drive through the picturesque Essex villages.

For me, it's about getting as much enjoyment out of the club as I can on a pensioners budget. While I would really love to do the Snowdon Drive in my RX8 in convoy with other enthusiast, it would mean I would have to compromise on other club events. I firmly believe the AM should be the event that is affordable and available to all members.

Finally, If we are talking about negative views and opinions about the club. Establish the facts first and please do not tar everyone with the same brush. Thank you.

[ChrisHolmes]

Slightly late to the party (turbo things etc etc) but let's draw a line under this now please chaps

Subject to her running anyone coming along that fancies taking my brappy turbo ASBO on wheels for a quick spin (that can fit in the bucket seat ) is more than welcome to

[DrewR3]

There was no simply stating any of the above in the message you composed, nor the initial tone and statement of "to far, to costly".

As stated in the initial reply. It is the duty of the committee to promote the AM and as such is why they bump. As before, the format has been changed to suit all budgets and remains open, no matter which direction a spiral is going. The club officials will always promote events to attempt maximum attendance.

What we can take from ticking a box is a historic democratic process to cast a vote for the will of the majority, to which officials then enact. As has been done here. You are quite right that then needs people to follow through. However, 17 votes and then 15 were originally signed up is close, again as previously stated many have sent apologies for pull outs, with at least 4 disclosing they are for serious illness and road traffic collision etc. Currently 8 remain, another 2 potential. Which likely would push it to one of the larger turn outs of the year given the poor numbers as all have noted.

Nobody was questioning your specific support of attending events with the club, as given I do alot of events also, I know and see you there. However, you listed the peak district drive? Snowdon AM is about 50 min further without turning off the motorways for the peak district cross country road from the m6, and that was just a drive not the AM. I also attended miluminations first iteration and drove to it from home near the Snowdon run in that time. Yet that was not labeled to far or costly for just a regular drive? And im not going to labour the point, and thank you for attending all those on whatever budget your personal circumstances are, however the AM is likely 1 tank of fuel taking it steady in travel for most, plus maybe a half when there. With no entry costs here like for an event. The food is provided by the club and accommodation could be as little as £10 to camp (granted that wouldn't be mine or likely your choice, B+B can be sought from £45)....given Yakushi cost to get in, for example, it would of been £75 to £150 given whether with partner or family, which the AM is always partners, for the camping ticket that allows you to stay beyond 4pm for festivities. This would then need the committee to undertake a massive amount of food prep and self catering as we did that year for Yakushi AM where tickets were also subsidised I believe as it was a big celebration. That would not be the case again, and frankly its expensive for not alot and that is actually one of the most costly shows of the season. With food falling on Christine predominantly as nearest. And then on top of that, others like me and perhaps yourself Derek would then need a B+B or hotel away from the field, given the area let's say a conservative £80 avg. So to sit in a field, for the AM, best case for a couple camping with an average fuel cost of half a tank shall we say would of been £120 as a conservative estimate, for upto a family staying in a B+B £300 for yakushi with entry and fuel. Providing that the Committee were to lay on food again. Seen as Snowdon does not have an entry fee and you can source your own accommodation. There would be very similar costs or lower, even with additional fuel from people travelling. The only difference is perhaps time of travel for some. In which others would gain less time and some more.

So yes, alot of the membership have taken an overly negative stance on this AM, without giving it the time, facts or thought of above. Last years AM between 2 shows requiring entry cost and a stately home expensive hotel, with even the fuel between 2 shows was so very very more costly than this. Yet every single person that has so far criticised this for cost, was also an attendee of that AM. Yet had no complaints because it was located in the south and involved jdm combe and near them. So the hypocracy is quite staggering from many.

For all of us it is about getting enjoyment from the club, which is why I was both disappointed and surprised at that initial post from you of all people. And as James I believe pointed out, it is indeed as you said sometimes about a compromise to not do something in place of other things pending your own circumstances. And I am not having a go, but not going to just one of those entry costing events would likely have been the cost of the snowdon trip pending accom choice and this was advertised in plenty of time to make that choice. But your own choice was to attend the others instead, which is absolutely fine and what you wanted to do. But then I find it disappointing to take the approach you initially had, possibly caused from your own choices of doing other things.

Beaulieu while we are being factual, had alot more than 2 members or rx8s also, it was actually a good turn out and not all members have just RX8s, however just from memory without looking i can recall at least 8 members, and 5 member RX8s plus the Rx7s etc which were member cars also.

[cabbageboi28]

It would be interesting if we could map out members (like on an actual map) and then work out from that which meets locations would be best and stuff

There is a member heat map which shows everyone's location. It may be a committee tool, not sure....

Latest heat map I have on record is this one from April 2023 (presented at the AGM).

Heatmap.jpg (28.92 KiB) Viewed 6891 times

One interpretation of the heatmap would be that events in in the Britsol- Birmingham-London triangle (or "rotor" maybe ) would present the most members with the least distance to travel. Other interpretations are available..................

Out of curiousity, I had a look back at the attendance at the 2020 AGM in Wigan. Using an East-West line through Leicester to define North/South ( know, arguable ) the attendees (inc partners) came from:

South: 31
North + Scotland: 7
NI: 2 (warpc0il + Pauline - funded by club in recognition of his services)

Very, very, roughly, you could say that lines up with the heat map, with the majority coming from the hotter membership areas.

Coincidentally, I think I'm right in saying the best attended events in 2025 look to be; JDM Combe, Shuttleworth AGM, Bicester and Brooklands, which all fall pretty much in the "Triangle/Rotor" zone.

[ChrisHolmes]

I think for the events team it would be a good idea to plan our "main" events around a map like this, is there any way to get one that's more up-to-date?

Like Malcolm said, Castle Combe was a huge success but the other events that weren't in this triangle did struggle. I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing - the Motorist event that Eva planned (might've got the name wrong) and Classic Japfest have still had some interest and they're handy for the people that simply don't have the funds to drive over 500 miles in a car with awful fuel economy. However, this means that we can cater AMs and our main events to the majority of the members.

I've never had an issue with this AM at all, although I can't attend this year I think it's a great weekend out, and I apologise for making this topic even further off topic but it might be something for Eva and the new Chairman to consider (if we get any nominations).

I think as our turnout is low for some of the events too, we really need to bring some more clubs together (Familia, RX7FB, MRC etc) to flesh out the numbers and make it more interesting for everyone.
Perhaps it's even worth us making a new topic for all members to discuss this? Seems like a hot topic right now.

[DrewR3]

I am afraid I disagree....not with the evidence, Malcolm has confirmed what we pretty much expected. That is irrefutable. And I completely agree that the success of the Monthly meets such as Oxford & London, and the shows such as JDM Combe all benefit from regular attendance due to the vicinity of members. And I agree holding such things as the AGM centrally for ease of access (It was me that suggested and found the BMM in Gaydon for the previous 2 AGMs, Will for Shuttleworth).

However the AM, everyone knows it is coming, It happens every year. Should be something different and a variety each year that people look forward to. Yes everyone has financial differences but putting away say £10 a month into an AM fund would cover your 500 mile countries for your example. This AM was presented months ago, granted we had to change due to the failure of sakura (a yakushi style central located show), which is why we then put it to vote to the membership and enacted there will with the winning vote. If the AM is not varied and not something to look forward to, then general attendanceother than those local to it will deplete. Also once again we will bend to those who have everything on the doorstep all year. I am not being precious, because luckily my circumstances are fortunate that I dont really mind 700 mile round trips for something i want to do like Goodwood this year, and its what I do for every show. However there is other people in that map that pay their subscriptions and people are happy to diregard them or their situations, that if we want to keep these people, I see no issue with once in a blue moon the membership convening on a fun new area. Im not even saying every year. The last 2 AMs were in that heat triangle malcolm has provided. Are we all so self centred or unadventurous that an event a mere 140 miles further than Yakushi deserves such pettiness and uproar to provide a different opportunity to enjoy something that people travel from all over the world for. When every other event is on the doorstep of those fortunate enough to be located in the Triangle. Its absolutely astonishing to me to negativity around the club doing anything outside of the triangle, and against an event that could be done on a lesser budget than the last AM.

I am out of the door as chair, if this is the view of the new chairman and Events team to continue to hold things on the m4 corridor, then so be it. And let the club follow its natural path. I still will possibly put 5k miles a year on my rx8 venturing down for them, though I expect other members will not be so willing and as such doubt they'll find value in renewing membership.