New starter, with starting issues

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TinkerBill
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New starter, with starting issues

Post by TinkerBill »

Morning all,

Bought myself an 08 RX8 in Jan after a combination of paycheck and old car dying. Been loving it, both commuting and exploring Surrey hills and the south coast.

But...

I was meant to go up to Scotland with friends for this week gone. Come back from work Friday evening, no issue, filled the tank and spent the weekend packing. Monday morning, got in the car and... she wouldn't fire :(

So, week later, having enjoyed the holiday, now need to fix the car.

No unusual warning lights that I've noticed, the car seems to be turning fine on the starter (but tbh she's never given a problem before so don't actually have much detail to work with...) and battery was sitting at 13v so shouldn't be a power issue.

I'm currently starting to remove and examine spark plugs, with coils the item after that to check.
Am I barking up the wrong tree? And have I missed the same question being asked and answered?

Thanks,
Bill
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Re: New starter, with starting issues

Post by warpc0il »

Flooded?

Was she switched off cold last time?

search.php?keywords=flood&fid%5B0%5D=25

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Re: New starter, with starting issues

Post by TinkerBill »

warpc0il wrote:
Mon Apr 22, 2019 9:16 am
Flooded?

Was she switched off cold last time?

search.php?keywords=flood&fid%5B0%5D=25

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I don't believe so, the last time she ran was a 60 mile drive, so should be hot at turn off. I removed the sparkplugs to inspect them (appear to be NGK iridium) and no sign of excess fuel (though again, too new to be certain). Will check for flooding fully next time I'm home (have had to crash around a friends for commuting until Thursday...)

Am currently thinking of getting in touch with Murdoch (https://www.facebook.com/Murdochs-Rotar ... 174826564/) but tbh bit stumped and so many help requests I'm getting lost in them... (not that this thread will help... 😣).

The car's Surrey based, suggestions on someone knowledgeable to throw her at so I don't make things worse?
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Re: New starter, with starting issues

Post by warpc0il »

You need to start (no pun intended) with the fundamentals; fuel, air, sparks, compression.

Let's assume that it's not a compression issues - at least for the time being.

Checking the plugs is good but you need to know if they're sparking. A set of cheap plug testers that stack between the HT leads and the plugs are a good induction. No sparks could mean that the PCM isn't being given rotation information from the Eccentrical Shaft Sensor (equivalent to the crankshaft sensor on an ordinary engine). If the wire was disconnected or the sensor had died then there would be a CEL. With no engine light it could still be a bit of metallic debris stuck to the sensor magnet.

Was there any sign/smell of fuel on the plugs? Maybe the fuel pump isn't running, either from a bad connection under the seat (has this car had the fuel tank recall work?) or a loose fuel pump fuse.

How far had you driven after filling with fuel? Is it possible that you've picked-up bad fuel or mis-fuelled with diesel? - It shouldn't be possible but at least one owner on here has admitted to doing this.
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TinkerBill (Tue Apr 23, 2019 6:32 am)
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Re: New starter, with starting issues

Post by Shagrington »

Hi and :welcome: TinkerBill. :D If you can't sort it yourself Luke (Murdoch) is a good lad and as he is mobile and will come to you he'd be the right person to call in. Alternatives not too far from Surrey (eg LC Rotary, Essex Rotary) would involve getting the car recovered to them.

As you are in Surrey, if you are around on Wednesday evenings, we have a monthly meet for chatting and food in Cobham - first Wednesday of every month - and you will be very welcome to come and join us viewtopic.php?f=99&t=59273
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TinkerBill (Tue Apr 23, 2019 6:32 am)
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Re: New starter, with starting issues

Post by 350matt »

If you have a scan tool / code reader that can do monitoring, it would be worth plugging that in to see if you're getting an rpm signal and if the rest of the sensors are reading something sensible
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Re: New starter, with starting issues

Post by TinkerBill »

warpc0il wrote:
Mon Apr 22, 2019 7:23 pm

Checking the plugs is good but you need to know if they're sparking. A set of cheap plug testers that stack between the HT leads and the plugs are a good induction. No sparks could mean that the PCM isn't being given rotation information from the Eccentrical Shaft Sensor (equivalent to the crankshaft sensor on an ordinary engine). If the wire was disconnected or the sensor had died then there would be a CEL. With no engine light it could still be a bit of metallic debris stuck to the sensor magnet.

I'll definitely grab myself a set of those then.

warpc0il wrote:
Mon Apr 22, 2019 7:23 pm
Was there any sign/smell of fuel on the plugs?

There was a definite smell of fuel, but the plugs didn't appear wet. I understand they're not placed directly into the rotor so would they be wet?

warpc0il wrote:
Mon Apr 22, 2019 7:23 pm
How far had you driven after filling with fuel? Is it possible that you've picked-up bad fuel or mis-fuelled with diesel? - It shouldn't be possible but at least one owner on here has admitted to doing this.
Not very far, but I am confident that I filled with petrol, and would hope Shell V-Power isn't bad...
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Re: New starter, with starting issues

Post by TinkerBill »

Shagrington wrote:
Mon Apr 22, 2019 9:22 pm
Hi and :welcome: TinkerBill. :D If you can't sort it yourself Luke (Murdoch) is a good lad and as he is mobile and will come to you he'd be the right person to call in. Alternatives not too far from Surrey (eg LC Rotary, Essex Rotary) would involve getting the car recovered to them.

As you are in Surrey, if you are around on Wednesday evenings, we have a monthly meet for chatting and food in Cobham - first Wednesday of every month - and you will be very welcome to come and join us viewtopic.php?f=99&t=59273
Hello! TBH I'm currently thinking of getting him in just so the car gets going again. Then may spend time this summer becoming more familiar with the engine bay so I can do more myself.

I've seen the meet in the calendar, and know where the Fairmile is so will definitely say hello when I can 🙂
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Re: New starter, with starting issues

Post by TinkerBill »

350matt wrote:
Mon Apr 22, 2019 9:52 pm
If you have a scan tool / code reader that can do monitoring, it would be worth plugging that in to see if you're getting an rpm signal and if the rest of the sensors are reading something sensible
I'm currently waiting on delivery for a cheapish Bluetooth OBDII reader, will see if it turns up before I can arrange to have Luke over.

If I don't get a signal, that indicate the shaft sensor is dead/unplugged?
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Re: New starter, with starting issues

Post by SprintRX8 »

Where abouts are you.
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Re: New starter, with starting issues

Post by warpc0il »

@TinkerBill update your profile with your location and consider joining the OC, as your best investment towards keeping the car.
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Re: New starter, with starting issues

Post by TinkerBill »

warpc0il wrote:
Tue Apr 23, 2019 10:08 am
@TinkerBill update your profile with your location and consider joining the OC, as your best investment towards keeping the car.
I'm currently chasing the OC as having tried to join the money was taken through PayPal but I recieved a 'registration unsuccessful' message.

I'm currently a little spread around with work, hence the lack of current location.
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Re: New starter, with starting issues

Post by Ainmhidh »

Hi Charles - I can see your application. I'll check with the treasurer and get back to you.
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TinkerBill (Fri Apr 26, 2019 1:08 pm)
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Re: New starter, with starting issues

Post by GreySilver Beast »

Hi Charles & :welcome: to the RX-8OC :thumleft:

Please check out the EVENTS SECTION's :thumleft: - Events Team

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TinkerBill (Fri Apr 26, 2019 1:07 pm)
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Re: New starter, with starting issues

Post by TinkerBill »

Cars running again, had Luke Murdoch come out. Was the coils, and he was happy to talk me through everything he did.
Thanks for all the help folks! Hopefully be able to do that job myself next time...
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Re: New starter, with starting issues

Post by TinkerBill »

And.... engine light, P0420 - Cat System Efficiency below Threshold. I'm assuming the bad coils may have had something to do with this?
Suggestions on replacing the cat (where do I look, need fast and reliable... I wish I could add cheap but know where that leads :( )? I'm not keen on decat as I don't want to play with the ECU yet.
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Re: New starter, with starting issues

Post by qwakers »

rotary revs or ryan rotary performance are the best plces imho to buy ANYTHING for the 8..

other trusted specialists are avaliable. :D
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Re: New starter, with starting issues

Post by Shagrington »

Fast and reliable describes Mazda Rotary Parts
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Re: New starter, with starting issues

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All you need to do is talk to Clive about something and it then arrives the next day, plus other bits that he recommends during the conversation!
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Re: New starter, with starting issues

Post by qwakers »

@TinkerBill...


i did reply to your pm, but it seems you haven't seen it as its still sitting in my outbox.

just letting you know it is in your inbox and i'm not ignoring you....