TRACKDAY : Tyres (for 18" wheels)

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warpc0il
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Re: Track tyres....

Post by warpc0il »

I'm curious to know if any of you have tried this stuff?
https://griptyresoftener.com/
Image

Years ago some of my mates that were into karting would swear by it, or at least the original version, since this has meant to be "Improved".

A friend had a nasty high-side on a bike track day at Mallory, again a while ago, which he blamed on using the stuff.
Spoiler:
For those not into biking, a high-side is when the tyres start to slide away (which isn't necessarily a bad thing if it's under your control) but then suddenly bite and you're thrown across the track like you've been catapulted.

I tried on the front tyres of a (hired) Vauxhall Carlton at an auto-test at North Weald in the 80's.
The weight of the car, the massive understeer, the really abrasive concrete surface and my lack of sympathy, resulted in the tyres left looking like they'd been attacked with a cheese grater. :shock: Though the instructions say to apply a few days before, and I'd only given it the lunch break... :roll:
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Re: Track tyres....

Post by Milos_Balunovic »

I would bet its a mix of MEKP (polyester resin catalyst - Methyl ethyl ketone peroxide) and some carrier. it is highly corrosive in natural form (usually will dissolve metal). and will soften "rubber"
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Re: Track tyres....

Post by warpc0il »

Contains:
Hydrocarbons, C11-14, n-alkanes, isoalkanes, cyclic, <2% aromatics
Hydrocarbons, C10, aromatics, >1% naphthalene
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0334/ ... s.pdf?1743
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Re: Track tyres....

Post by nightfire10 »

Looking at replacing the worn out fed 595s any recommendations for price or alternative dry tyres ? :race:
Hayward's Street/bridgeported rebuild,595's,Tein coilovers edfc Racingbeat rear anti roll bar oil pres oil temp gauge pod's,lockwood front rear grills,Tinted wind ws folding tow hook's,595s,connect2 ,at long last sohn and ap50 tank instaled ,revi ram air duct already fitted ! calipers painted,diff oil changed .
just oil lines to fit at some stage ( had them a while too) :P

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Re: Track tyres....

Post by mrspiller »

nightfire10 wrote:Looking at replacing the worn out fed 595s any recommendations for price or alternative dry tyres ? :race:
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Re: Track tyres....

Post by nightfire10 »

mrspiller wrote:
Sun Aug 22, 2021 5:07 pm
nightfire10 wrote:Looking at replacing the worn out fed 595s any recommendations for price or alternative dry tyres ? :race:
Slicks ImageImage
what keep using the old 595s till there ain't no tread left :lol:

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Hayward's Street/bridgeported rebuild,595's,Tein coilovers edfc Racingbeat rear anti roll bar oil pres oil temp gauge pod's,lockwood front rear grills,Tinted wind ws folding tow hook's,595s,connect2 ,at long last sohn and ap50 tank instaled ,revi ram air duct already fitted ! calipers painted,diff oil changed .
just oil lines to fit at some stage ( had them a while too) :P

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Re: Track tyres....

Post by mrspiller »

nightfire10 wrote:
mrspiller wrote:
Sun Aug 22, 2021 5:07 pm
nightfire10 wrote:Looking at replacing the worn out fed 595s any recommendations for price or alternative dry tyres ? :race:
Slicks ImageImage
what keep using the old 595s till there ain't no tread left :lol:

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Re: Track tyres....

Post by cib24 »

R888Rs. I just used them at Blyton on 17x9 wheels with 255/40R17 square on my bone stock RX-8 with cat and roly-poly stock suspension.

I was running within half a second of a RX-8 on Federals with coilovers, ARBs, track alignment, full Racing Beat exhaust, uprated discs and pads, and an experienced driver.

I couldn’t get the tyres to fall off before my coolant temps got too hot and I needed to do a cool down lap.

Looking forward to trying them again soon at Brands.
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Re: Track tyres....

Post by nightfire10 »

Expensive tyres

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Hayward's Street/bridgeported rebuild,595's,Tein coilovers edfc Racingbeat rear anti roll bar oil pres oil temp gauge pod's,lockwood front rear grills,Tinted wind ws folding tow hook's,595s,connect2 ,at long last sohn and ap50 tank instaled ,revi ram air duct already fitted ! calipers painted,diff oil changed .
just oil lines to fit at some stage ( had them a while too) :P

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Re: Track tyres....

Post by bc-49 »

Something in the same category would be Nankang NS-2R or the Yokohama AD08RS.

Nankang’s are cheap, I paid £400 for my set from Driftworks I think it was. Yokos are a bit more expensive.

Haven’t used the 595 or AD08RS, so I don’t have a direct comparison for you in terms of performance.


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Re: Track tyres....

Post by New Duke »

Remember that 595s come in two different compounds. A softer and a harder one that perform differently.

If you had the harder compound on before then the softer one is well worth trying. I'm a fan.
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Re: Track tyres....

Post by MightyCondor »

I don't think the 2 Federal compounds have that much of a difference between them.

I have a set of track wheels with a pair of 140 and the other with 220. I wasn't aware of this when I first used them and had major handling issues at Mallory which turned out to be due to my alignment being knocked out rather than the tyres

Since fixing that, I've done one track day at Thruxton with the 140s on the front and another at Blyton with them on the rear (I'm the car that Roy was referring to above). Overall balance was good at both tracks and tyres have lasted well without overheating. The inside of the front left 140 tyre did wear heavily at Thruxton, but it's a tough circuit...

I wouldn't mind trying Cup 2s next to see if I can feel an improvement. At both of the above mentioned track days, I've been in the presence of cars running them and achieving very impressive cornering speeds.

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Re: Track tyres....

Post by mrspiller »

nightfire10 wrote:Expensive tyres

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I find they fall off after 8 laps


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Re: Track tyres....

Post by mrspiller »

MightyCondor wrote:I don't think the 2 Federal compounds have that much of a difference between them.

I have a set of track wheels with a pair of 140 and the other with 220. I wasn't aware of this when I first used them and had major handling issues at Mallory which turned out to be due to my alignment being knocked out rather than the tyres

Since fixing that, I've done one track day at Thruxton with the 140s on the front and another at Blyton with them on the rear (I'm the car that Roy was referring to above). Overall balance was good at both tracks and tyres have lasted well without overheating. The inside of the front left 140 tyre did wear heavily at Thruxton, but it's a tough circuit...

I wouldn't mind trying Cup 2s next to see if I can feel an improvement. At both of the above mentioned track days, I've been in the presence of cars running them and achieving very impressive cornering speeds.

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What front camber are you running Alan ?
I always find out edge FNS wears a bit a heavy at thruxton - not much tho
Many have said it hard on tyres but I’ve always found it pretty balanced
Compared to clockwise circuits


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Re: Track tyres....

Post by MightyCondor »


mrspiller wrote: What front camber are you running Alan ?
I always find out edge FNS wears a bit a heavy at thruxton - not much tho
Many have said it hard on tyres but I’ve always found it pretty balanced
Compared to clockwise circuits


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I don't know unfortunately. Fergus didn't give me a record of the settings. I haven't noticed uneven wear at any other track, although haven't had many dry days in that time, so that doesn't mean much.



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Re: Track tyres....

Post by cib24 »

How about Zestino’s? They are becoming regarded as a good budget track day tyre that are priced like Federals and apparently a bit better.

Also, to the person that finds the tyres fall off after 8 laps, what mods do you have to keep you out there that long? I’ve got a bone stock 8 and I was getting hot with the coolant gauge starting to move after about 3-4 laps at Blyton on a 25 degree high humidity day. Alan said I should try blocking off airflow around the radiator to see if that helps first, but I’d guess the diff and gearbox get pretty hot on track too although there are no warnings for them via the ECU as far as I’m aware.
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Re: Track tyres....

Post by New Duke »

cib24 wrote:
Wed Aug 25, 2021 7:33 am
Also, to the person that finds the tyres fall off after 8 laps, what mods do you have to keep you out there that long? I’ve got a bone stock 8 and I was getting hot with the coolant gauge starting to move after about 3-4 laps at Blyton on a 25 degree high humidity day. Alan said I should try blocking off airflow around the radiator to see if that helps first, but I’d guess the diff and gearbox get pretty hot on track too although there are no warnings for them via the ECU as far as I’m aware.
Try flushing your coolant and check it doesn't have any leaks.

Or buy a ram scoop. Mine lowers my temps by about 5 degrees.

25C is hot though. So it's not surprising you got toasty. At least it's not that hot very often in the UK. But don't worry if the coolant guage moves, so long as you don't overheat it's fine. Managing that needle is part of the game. But you could fit a gauge with an alarm if you're concerned about it.

You can also try shifting up 1or 2k rpm earlier when your needle starts to go up. The biggest difference there will be not running it to the rev limiter on the straights every lap. There's when you'll run hottest.

All of that should only really factor on v hot days tho.
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Re: Track tyres....

Post by bc-49 »

Seconded regarding the short shifting tip, it does make a big difference imo.

I purposely tend to pick track days in the Spring/Autumn as cooling is always something I’ve struggled with.


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Re: Track tyres....

Post by Conan »

Hi Steve,
I’d stick with the Federals if I was you.
I recommended these years ago and they still give very good value for money and performance.
The important thing about a tyre is how it behaves as it approaches the limit, on the limit and beyond the limit.
The Federal is very predictable through the sequence and helps to improve the drivers ability.
Moving to another tyre can mean leaning the differences and changing the set up on the car to suit. ( for example if you if you change to a very sticky tyre with increased braking grip and more dive on the front you may want to increase front bump a couple of clicks and rear rebound a couple of clicks and that’s without set up changes for handling ), I won’t go into lots of detail.
Some sticky tyres snap away very quickly when pushed past the limit rather than progressively like other tyres.
If you want a change you could consider some 17” wheels in 8.5 or 9” Jay with 245 or 255 Federals.
Your first time on track with me was 255 x 17 x 9” Federal shod.
Hope that gives you something to consider
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Re: Track tyres....

Post by nightfire10 »

Might Leave the old ones on fot the 14th at combe and wear them out completely lol and I think I will use feds again mine are 235s


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Hayward's Street/bridgeported rebuild,595's,Tein coilovers edfc Racingbeat rear anti roll bar oil pres oil temp gauge pod's,lockwood front rear grills,Tinted wind ws folding tow hook's,595s,connect2 ,at long last sohn and ap50 tank instaled ,revi ram air duct already fitted ! calipers painted,diff oil changed .
just oil lines to fit at some stage ( had them a while too) :P

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