DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Any form of normally aspirated power mods.
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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by Phil Bate » Tue Apr 08, 2014 1:19 am

Just to confirm the above OpenPort logging file works a treat, enjoy :)
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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by brix79 » Tue Apr 08, 2014 1:24 am

I look forward to the next episode of...

'Tuning with Phil'

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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by Arnie_O » Thu Apr 10, 2014 1:02 am

Nice will take a look at this soon.
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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by Liam22 » Fri Jul 18, 2014 3:58 pm

Just forked over my $250 for MazdaEdit. Looking forward to reading this thread (properly) from start to finish now :)

Starting with the simple things: D858 dwell, cat removal, SAI removal

Hoping to spend some time doing some real world mapping on a rolling road once I'm comfortable with the software. I used to have a Lotus Elise with an Emerald programmable ECU so I've been through the (steep!) learning curve before.

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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by warpc0il » Fri Jul 18, 2014 6:20 pm

I've finally got around to reading this thread through from the beginning, and it's all very interesting.

Just a thought on the chatter and engine braking connection...

The septics report chatter damage on 4-port engines, like our 192 but theirs are all automatics.
AFAIK it's impossible to engine brake with an auto 'box, so that theory doesn't hold.

Anyway, it looks like I'm going to be paying Aston a visit before we take our 8 over to NI...
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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by warpc0il » Fri Jul 18, 2014 7:26 pm

:scratch: I know this thinking thing can be dangerous, but..

:-k :idea:

The DSC/TC/ABS is all handled by a separate system, which has direct control of the individual wheel brakes, to control over/understeer and wheelspin.

However, when it decides that engine power must be reduced, all it can do is signal to the ECU, and it's then up to the ECU to determine what to do, the standard reaction being to reduce throttle input and retard the ignition.

Presumably there's a map that determines the exact strategy; e.g. how long to wait and how aggressively to intervene.

Is this map accessible/modifiable?

Could we choose to have the DSC be more lenient but still act as a safety net in the event of extreme lead-footedness?
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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by Will66 » Fri Jul 18, 2014 7:31 pm

I think the DSC exerts direct control over the electronic throttle rather than through some strategy in the engine control algorithm, to the ECU it would seem no different to taking your foot off the throttle. That's certainly how the schematic in the manual seems to illustrate it. So I don't think your idea will work.
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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by Phil Bate » Fri Jul 18, 2014 7:55 pm

I believe the stability control routine calls for a torque reduction, which is handled through commanded torque figures in the ECU. The tables for the commanded torque are available but I don't think you could edit them for that purpose without affecting anything else. I'll have a look tonight to refresh and post in more detail
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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by Phil Bate » Sat Jul 19, 2014 1:06 am

A quick skip through the tech guide suggests there are three schemes employed by the PCM when issued a torque-down request. I guess these will be in addition to any single wheel brake activations handled by the ABS unit:

Throttle valve opening control
Ignition timing retard control
Fuel cut control


I'm not sure what sequence or combination these are employed in. If my MazdaEdit laptop has charge I'll fire it up and take a look at the maps after this beer (it's been a long two weeks!)
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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by Liam22 » Tue Jul 22, 2014 11:28 am

Got my ROM from epifan today. Let the tinkering begin... :)

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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by Phil Bate » Tue Jul 22, 2014 8:08 pm

Great stuff, you will love it. Keep this thread updated with progress and questions :)
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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by Liam22 » Tue Jul 22, 2014 9:17 pm

Thanks Phil.

Are the dwell times on page 2 of this thread reliable? That's my first mod.

Plan is this:

1. Make a backup "stage 0 backup" ROM (no changes)
2. Build a "stage 1" ROM with updated dwell times, DTC deletes and OMP rate adjustments
3. Get familiar with making on-the-fly fuel injection and ignition timing changes to single and multiple cells
4. Rolling road session:
(a) Power run with stage 0 ROM
(b) Power run with stage 1 ROM
(c) Mapping for power with injection/ignition changes

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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by Phil Bate » Tue Jul 22, 2014 11:09 pm

Yes they are the settings I use, I have attached them to this post in Excel format so you can simply copy and paste into MazdaEdit :)

When saving different ROMs remember there is a text box in the map properties where you can add tune notes/comments - I document the changes I have made for quick reference.
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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by Phil Bate » Thu Aug 07, 2014 12:47 am

Here is a useful bit of information I meant to post a while ago. It's a neat description explaining the difference between absolute and calculated load, containing the formulae used to derive each. Taken from http://autotechconsultants.info (and tidied up a little bit):
Calculated Load and Absolute Load Calculations / Definition

There are two types of LOAD specified in SAE J1979. One is CALCULATED LOAD VALUE and the other is ABSOLUTE LOAD VALUE.

Calculated Load Value (PID 04)

The OBD regulations previously defined CLV as: (current airflow / peak airflow @sea level) * (BARO @ sea level / BARO) * 100%

Various manufacturers have implemented this calculation in a variety of ways. The following definition, although a little more restrictive, will standardise and improve the accuracy the calculation.

LOAD_PCT = [current airflow] / [(peak airflow at WOT@STP as a function of rpm) * (BARO/29.92) * SQRT(298/(AAT+273))]

Where:
• STP = Standard Temperature and Pressure = 25 °C, 29.92 in Hg BARO, SQRT = square root
• WOT = wide open throttle, AAT = Ambient Air Temperature and is in °C

Characteristics of LOAD_PCT are:
• Reaches 1.0 at WOT at any altitude, temperature or rpm for both naturally aspirated and boosted engines.
• Indicates percent of peak available torque.
• Linearly correlated with engine vacuum
• Often used to schedule power enrichment.
• Compression ignition engines (diesels) shall support this PID using fuel flow in place of airflow for the above calculations.

NOTE Both spark ignition and compression ignition engines shall support PID $04. See PID $43 for an additional definition of engine LOAD.


Absolute Load Value (PID 43)

The absolute load value has some different characteristics than the LOAD_PCT defined in PID 04. This definition, although restrictive, will standardise the calculation. LOAD_ABS is the normalised value of air mass per intake stroke displayed as a percent.

LOAD_ABS = [air mass (g / intake stroke)] / [1.184 (g / intake stroke) * cylinder displacement in litres]

Derivation:
• air mass (g / intake stroke) = [total engine air mass (g/sec)] / [rpm (revs/min)* (1 min / 60sec) * (1/2 # of cylinders (strokes / rev)],
• LOAD_ABS = [air mass (g)/intake stroke] / [maximum air mass (g)/intake stroke at WOT@STP at 100% volumetric efficiency]
• * 100%. Where:
• — STP = Standard Temperature and Pressure = 25 °C, 29.92 in Hg (101.3 kPa) BARO, WOT = wide open throttle.

The quantity (maximum air mass (g)/intake stroke at WOT@STP at 100% volumetric efficiency) is a constant for a given cylinder swept volume. The constant is 1.184 (g/litre 3) * cylinder displacement (litre 3/intake stroke) based on air density at STP.

Characteristics of LOAD_ABS are:
• Ranges from 0 to approximately 0.95 for naturally aspirated engines, 0 – 4 for boosted engines
• Linearly correlated with engine indicated and brake torque,
• Often used to schedule spark and EGR rates,
• Peak value of LOAD_ABS correlates with volumetric efficiency at WOT.,
• Indicates the pumping efficiency of the engine for diagnostic purposes.

Spark ignition engine are required to support PID $43. Compression ignition (diesel) engines are not required to support this PID.
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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by Nerdstrike » Thu Aug 07, 2014 8:25 am

Excellent quality information there!

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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by warpc0il » Thu Aug 07, 2014 11:42 am

So, when calculating ALV you get caught in the great debate about what is the swept volume and displacement of a rotary engine...
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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by Phil Bate » Thu Aug 07, 2014 1:39 pm

Oh yes :) when I get a minute I will calculate it back from my log data and see what Mazda interpret it as.

I posted the info mainly to illustrate why a ported or boosted engine will hit the calculated load ceiling and exceed 100% absolute load
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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by warpc0il » Thu Aug 07, 2014 2:09 pm

Just make sure you're giving it 110% :wink:
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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by Biguns » Tue Mar 03, 2015 9:58 pm

Fantastic read phil thanks for all the info
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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by Phil Bate » Thu Mar 12, 2015 12:29 am

During a sort of tuning hiatus (bought on by making sure everything was in perfect order with my engine) I have had time to spend many, many hours researching and deciding the best way to go forward. I chose a more difficult method (of course :roll: ) but one that I believe is better.

This involves calibrating everything first so that the PCM knows with the best accuracy how much air is going in, how much fuel it is adding, and how much the engine can actually do at any given moment. First up was scaling the MAF sensor - many hours of logging sessions in both open loop and closed loop allowed a picture to be built of where the sensor is over and under reading. In general my sensor was under reading by 9% across the board except for some areas, so I started by scaling the whole MAF table up by 9% (safer that way), logging some more and then targeting areas that were building a fuel trim by analysing trends in the data with Excel. (Only the other night it occurred to me how much I use Excel to work on my car, but this really takes the biscuit!)

maf_calibration.png
No crazy trends to look at here - I'm still tweaking the higher flow values which proves tricky on the road. As they are typically in open loop mode you look at the difference in target and actual afr instead of trim to quantify the MAF inaccuracy. The car is already responding well to just this small step. The maximum LTFT I see now is 0.8% which should disappear after more tweaking, and total trims during cruise oscillate no more than 1.56% either way.

Having this right already means the car exits closed loop very smoothly, and you could literally unlplug the front O2 sensor and wouldn't notice the difference by driving it. In fact it is now possible to change the closed loop exit RPM to a very low figure to force the PCM to run in open loop all the time, which helps with the mid-range calibration.

During WOT runs it is now sort of hitting the target values I currently have in the fuel tables, which is better than the crap shoot it was before. The closer to these it gets proves the accuracy of the MAF readings.

afr_targets.png

The graph exaggerates a little but the trend is there, still work to be done!
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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by Phil Bate » Thu Mar 12, 2015 12:49 am

warpc0il wrote:Just make sure you're giving it 110% :wink:
mafscaling_wot2nd002.png
Almost Dave, almost. Bigger ports required :)
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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by Nerdstrike » Thu Mar 12, 2015 9:48 am

I very much like your attempt to get it running perfectly, definitely going above and beyond. You're probably getting close to the error bars with this level of involvement, and it won't be long before other factors are taking control, like surprise dips in local air pressure when you drive through crosswinds and such. Is it also possible that you'll start to expose non-linearity of sensors with respect to pressure and temperature? I'm not sure how the MAF truly works. It would suck if you optimised really well and then along came summer and everything went off target.

On a related note, I did some logging on my car and was surprised to see just how much more air a rotary pumps. My car has a similar power output, but the MAF readings are peaking near 150 g/s. It's a whole 25+% lower air flow!

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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by Phil Bate » Thu Mar 12, 2015 10:29 am

The MAF sensor is of the hot wire type - sensors not being linear doesn't matter as they are all referenced against their own maps. You can modify them all in MazdaEdit however MAF is the main one of interest. It wouldn't really matter if ECT was a degree or two out, or IAT for that matter.

The MAF sensor measures the air mass so is unaffected by its temperature, it still knows how much air is going in. I am considering swapping it for a hot-film type sensor instead. Bosch make some very nice ones that are much less susceptible to contamination, and better at low air flows and when reversion occurs at idle.


I think the difference in figures you are seeing with your new car illustrates the terrible mpg of a rotary quite nicely - all that extra air needs extra fuel :)
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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by warpc0il » Fri Apr 10, 2015 9:38 pm

It's also why turbo kits designed for similar power piston engines are useless for rotaries.
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Re: DIY tuning/remapping with mazdaEdit and Openport

Post by MadTaz » Wed Jun 24, 2015 10:52 am

i would like to try and scale the MAF on my borthers NA car,

A little sure of how to go about it, I understand the that if your building trim then either its under or over reading just not sure on the methodology of actually doing the scaling.

Also what does it actually mean when scaling in either closed or open loop?

any chance of an idiots guide on Mazdaedit topics like

MAF scaling
Fuel enrichment/tuning
Calc Max load (what is this?)

Thanks in advance for any information/guide

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