Talking Carbs

Any form of normally aspirated power mods.
audiobull
Former Member
Former Member
Posts: 1749
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2011 8:18 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Strato Blue
Location: portsmouth
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Talking Carbs

Post by audiobull » Sat Sep 07, 2013 11:45 am

i am looking at making something a little more then average. I do want a bridge or street port while rebuilding BUT i have been looking at turbo kits. After having a read up and talking with others i have been put off the idea of forced induction so time to think of something else. The rotary sounds awesome N/A with work done but if i wanted to go carb where do i start looking?
ive seen there is a kit/adaptor for the inlet manifold but what about the ecu and what else am i not thinking about reading up on? it cant be impossible just because its not off the shelf.

Mod bit - moved here as it's this sort of thing!

User avatar
warpc0il
Spin Doctor
Spin Doctor
Posts: 25581
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2008 10:56 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Lightning Yellow
Location: Groomsport, Co Down, NI
Has thanked: 456 times
Been thanked: 1831 times
Contact:

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by warpc0il » Sat Sep 07, 2013 2:56 pm

Carbs aren't an option on an 8 for street use as there's no way you can manage the emissions.

RX-7's can run carbs as most were build prior to the emission and catalytic converter regulations.
Dave
The Spin Doctor ™
uǝǝɹɔs ɹnoʎ ʇɹǝʌuı ǝsɐǝld :ɹoɹɹǝ

audiobull
Former Member
Former Member
Posts: 1749
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2011 8:18 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Strato Blue
Location: portsmouth
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by audiobull » Sat Sep 07, 2013 4:09 pm

Thank you Dave but that is not a constructive reply. Everyone with a decat will fail emissions!!

User avatar
Conan
Club Member
Club Member
Posts: 6194
Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2011 9:22 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Brilliant Black
Location: Cotswolds
Has thanked: 56 times
Been thanked: 733 times

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by Conan » Sat Sep 07, 2013 4:18 pm

Set of 4 motorcycle carbs (I have a set of38mm Amal flat slides)
It would be possible but difficult to convert to carbs.
Events Coordinator. 2014 to 2017

I’m an expert in nothing....I have made mistakes in everything

audiobull
Former Member
Former Member
Posts: 1749
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2011 8:18 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Strato Blue
Location: portsmouth
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by audiobull » Sat Sep 07, 2013 4:33 pm

Thanks pete. This is the adaptor i am looking at. i do not know where to start with on the ecu injector side of things. does anyone know where i can read up on it?

http://www.racingbeat.com/RX8/Intake-Ki ... 16480.html

User avatar
warpc0il
Spin Doctor
Spin Doctor
Posts: 25581
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2008 10:56 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Lightning Yellow
Location: Groomsport, Co Down, NI
Has thanked: 456 times
Been thanked: 1831 times
Contact:

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by warpc0il » Sat Sep 07, 2013 6:57 pm

audiobull wrote:Thank you Dave but that is not a constructive reply.
It was meant to be constructive and save you from a lot of potential issues.
audiobull wrote:Everyone with a decat will fail emissions!!
Yes, they will but a decat is easy to replace with a cat once a year.

If this was for a dedicated track car I'd be the first to encourage you but is it really worth the grief for street use?
Dave
The Spin Doctor ™
uǝǝɹɔs ɹnoʎ ʇɹǝʌuı ǝsɐǝld :ɹoɹɹǝ

bigpete
Forum Trader
Forum Trader
Posts: 5020
Joined: Mon Apr 18, 2011 7:20 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Custom
Location: Boston Lincs PE20 2NZ
Has thanked: 499 times
Been thanked: 251 times

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by bigpete » Sat Sep 07, 2013 7:10 pm

you can buy the carbs from the race beat site as well :) if i read that right. not sure on the rest tho.
Bigpete

Comp testing, parts for sale and fitting service, Servicing
Non runners bought for cash.
Contact: 07932678556
Location: Boston Linc's

http://paypal.me/bostonrotary

http://stores.ebay.co.uk/BostonRotary

https://www.facebook.com/BostonRotary

User avatar
Bulldog
Former Member
Former Member
Posts: 7450
Joined: Tue Apr 05, 2011 11:49 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Sunlight Silver
Location: Liverpool
Has thanked: 15 times
Been thanked: 90 times

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by Bulldog » Sat Sep 07, 2013 7:30 pm

Loving it :)

Cant wait to see how this goes
It is by going down into the abyss that we recover the treasures of life. Where you stumble, there lies your treasure.

More info in my project thread

Worry about your character, not your reputation. Your character is who you are, and your reputation is who people think you are.

audiobull
Former Member
Former Member
Posts: 1749
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2011 8:18 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Strato Blue
Location: portsmouth
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by audiobull » Sat Sep 07, 2013 7:34 pm

it will be for the track so i may ask elsewhere for info regarding this subject. awaiting info back from RB too.

I think if someones willing to change it all over for mot then that is down to them, just giving a straight it wont work answer is not the kind of advice that should be given. I do completely understand it wont pass an mot and it will be a pain in the bum to get running, it is good to hear other opinions but we didnt get the turbo kit without someone actually trying it.

User avatar
Phil Bate
Spin Doctor
Spin Doctor
Posts: 9256
Joined: Thu Mar 22, 2012 12:49 am
RX-8: 231
Colour: Sunlight Silver
Location: South Wales
Has thanked: 36 times
Been thanked: 169 times

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by Phil Bate » Sat Sep 07, 2013 7:46 pm

I think Dave assumed it was to be roadworthy in which case the most helpful advice would be negative. Now we know it's for track only that's a different matter, go nuts!
Phil's subtle sunlight silver - stronger, faster, with added red bits and stuff engine donor!
Operation Mint - Kuro preservation project
The pimped out Glacier White XE - quintessential British motoring from Jaguar

audiobull
Former Member
Former Member
Posts: 1749
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2011 8:18 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Strato Blue
Location: portsmouth
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by audiobull » Sat Sep 07, 2013 7:49 pm

i see :oops: , good point sorry dave.
well when its complete ill get a test done just to see how bad it is. if its bad it will be track only, not too bad ill fiddle some more till it passes i guess. or buy another rex for the road.

User avatar
Bulldog
Former Member
Former Member
Posts: 7450
Joined: Tue Apr 05, 2011 11:49 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Sunlight Silver
Location: Liverpool
Has thanked: 15 times
Been thanked: 90 times

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by Bulldog » Sat Sep 07, 2013 7:54 pm

Ben we are looking at some different ECU options for the FI stuff. The adaptronics gives you an outstanding amount of configuration.

There is a place called EFI parts that may provide you with a lot of info, also pip at WGT does some intresting builds.

http://www.efi-parts.co.uk/index.php?show_aux_page=5

http://www.bitsofitaly.com/dyno-tuning-weber--efi
It is by going down into the abyss that we recover the treasures of life. Where you stumble, there lies your treasure.

More info in my project thread

Worry about your character, not your reputation. Your character is who you are, and your reputation is who people think you are.

audiobull
Former Member
Former Member
Posts: 1749
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2011 8:18 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Strato Blue
Location: portsmouth
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by audiobull » Sat Sep 07, 2013 8:12 pm

Mike thats great ill give them a shout on monday and have a chat. i have looked at the adaptronics and it ticks loads of boxes. just need to read up more about it and what i actually need for my setup.

User avatar
Will66
Communications Team
Communications Team
Posts: 17936
Joined: Sat Apr 14, 2007 6:45 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Metropolitan Grey
Location: Bury St Edmunds
Has thanked: 8 times
Been thanked: 47 times

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by Will66 » Sat Sep 07, 2013 9:30 pm

If you're running carbs you'll only need an ignition system, you'll be able to do away with loads of the electronic gumpf and just have an electronic ignition control system. [urlw=http://www.msdignition.com/]MSD Ignition[/urlw] are a big player in this market, their magnetos are used on Nitromethane burning Top Fuel engines and it's a part you regularly see on old school motors with beefy ignition requirements. You might be able to do something like run an old school 13B front cover with a distributor. The ignition system on the FB RX7 copes with decent power and would make it a lot easier than getting an aftermarket ignition system to fire the RX8 coils.

You'll need to run an OMP (RX8 engines will chew side seals without it) so whatever carb you choose will need to have a vacuum take off, you'll also need one for the brake servo unless you're changing out the master cylinder for a race set up type jobbie without a servo (useful if you're going to run bigger brake callipers).

It might also be worth considering a BHR long tube manifold for an N/A set up as it should make good power gains. If you're planning to compete the car in race series you'll need to run a catalytic converter though.
RX8OC Met Advisor and Ex-Moderator!
Miss May 2013 with these modifications02 November 2012

Certified Tarmac Terrorist! Evading the colour police since March 2013 :ninja:

Mazda RX8 - The Liv Tyler's Lips of Motoring

audiobull
Former Member
Former Member
Posts: 1749
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2011 8:18 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Strato Blue
Location: portsmouth
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by audiobull » Sat Sep 07, 2013 10:23 pm

will thank you thank you thank you. That is the type of info i was after. I now have something to start with and also have something to think about with the casing during the rebuild.
I was planning up, over and straight up with it :notworthy: rather then the long pipe.
going to get an order for parts placed soon as i guess it will take a while to get to me.

User avatar
Will66
Communications Team
Communications Team
Posts: 17936
Joined: Sat Apr 14, 2007 6:45 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Metropolitan Grey
Location: Bury St Edmunds
Has thanked: 8 times
Been thanked: 47 times

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by Will66 » Sat Sep 07, 2013 10:29 pm

The BHR manifold is or the exhaust rather than the intake. The intake manifold will depend on your choice of carb.
RX8OC Met Advisor and Ex-Moderator!
Miss May 2013 with these modifications02 November 2012

Certified Tarmac Terrorist! Evading the colour police since March 2013 :ninja:

Mazda RX8 - The Liv Tyler's Lips of Motoring

User avatar
vic_cambridge
Former Member
Former Member
Posts: 1767
Joined: Sun Mar 04, 2012 12:30 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Titanium Grey
Location: Cambridge
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 4 times

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by vic_cambridge » Sat Sep 07, 2013 10:38 pm

I can understand you wanting something a bit different but I can see this being one almighty pain in the ass! Why??? Years of technology evolve to improve car performance with fuel injection, ecu's, fly by wire throttle.....and you just want to rip it out to have something different? Good luck dude I hope all the effort and cash that will go into it will not dissapoint at the end.

I'm sure the word 'not' was missed by mistake - it is in now
Eibach Lowering Springs, Axial Short Shifter, Tarox F2000 Brake Discs, Braided Brake Lines, K & N Air Filter, Magnecor Leads, Rotary Revs D585 Coils, Toyosport Oil catch can, Rotary Revs Rebuild *SOLD October 2014*

New Ride: Mercedes CLC 220 CDI

User avatar
Will66
Communications Team
Communications Team
Posts: 17936
Joined: Sat Apr 14, 2007 6:45 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Metropolitan Grey
Location: Bury St Edmunds
Has thanked: 8 times
Been thanked: 47 times

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by Will66 » Sat Sep 07, 2013 10:39 pm

I don't think it will disappoint, carbs will be fantastically responsive and will make amazing noises. It will also be very simple, might even make a little more power. It won't ever comply with emissions and it will be thirsty but it will be an interesting and different beast.
RX8OC Met Advisor and Ex-Moderator!
Miss May 2013 with these modifications02 November 2012

Certified Tarmac Terrorist! Evading the colour police since March 2013 :ninja:

Mazda RX8 - The Liv Tyler's Lips of Motoring

audiobull
Former Member
Former Member
Posts: 1749
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2011 8:18 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Strato Blue
Location: portsmouth
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by audiobull » Sat Sep 07, 2013 10:54 pm

hmmm i must be looking in the wrong place. couldnt find anything on the exhaust manifold on there website. ill search again tomorrow.

anyway the lump will start to get disconnected from the car tomorrow ready for a strip down. :mrgreen:





*edited. decided not to go to the level of some others*

User avatar
Conan
Club Member
Club Member
Posts: 6194
Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2011 9:22 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Brilliant Black
Location: Cotswolds
Has thanked: 56 times
Been thanked: 733 times

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by Conan » Sat Sep 07, 2013 10:56 pm

It,s not for the faint hearted!!
I wouldn,t contenplate it myself unless it was for a dedicated race car and the series allowed it. I,ve seen lots of motorcycle carbs mounted on car engines including old F3 cars. It,s quite easy to make up the manifold and mount them on rubber tubes. The ECU,s are not my territory and you need the oil injection facility unless you rely on pre-mix alone.

PS: I don,t think Vic ment it that way, I think the little word (not) got left out.
Last edited by Conan on Sat Sep 07, 2013 11:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Events Coordinator. 2014 to 2017

I’m an expert in nothing....I have made mistakes in everything

User avatar
Will66
Communications Team
Communications Team
Posts: 17936
Joined: Sat Apr 14, 2007 6:45 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Metropolitan Grey
Location: Bury St Edmunds
Has thanked: 8 times
Been thanked: 47 times

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by Will66 » Sat Sep 07, 2013 11:00 pm

Check BHR's facebook page for information on the manifold, it should be good for more power, particularly on a igh revving n/a carb set up. If you're going track only then you could run a mega light flywheel too, make the most the throttle response.
RX8OC Met Advisor and Ex-Moderator!
Miss May 2013 with these modifications02 November 2012

Certified Tarmac Terrorist! Evading the colour police since March 2013 :ninja:

Mazda RX8 - The Liv Tyler's Lips of Motoring

User avatar
vic_cambridge
Former Member
Former Member
Posts: 1767
Joined: Sun Mar 04, 2012 12:30 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Titanium Grey
Location: Cambridge
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 4 times

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by vic_cambridge » Sun Sep 08, 2013 12:35 am

Lol Yes 'not' was meant to be in there, thanks for adding that for me :)
Eibach Lowering Springs, Axial Short Shifter, Tarox F2000 Brake Discs, Braided Brake Lines, K & N Air Filter, Magnecor Leads, Rotary Revs D585 Coils, Toyosport Oil catch can, Rotary Revs Rebuild *SOLD October 2014*

New Ride: Mercedes CLC 220 CDI

Nerdstrike
Former Member
Former Member
Posts: 2630
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2011 7:47 pm
RX-8: 231
Colour: Velocity Red
Location: Cambridgeshire
Has thanked: 7 times
Been thanked: 31 times

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by Nerdstrike » Sun Sep 08, 2013 12:37 am

It occurs to me that the OMP issue could be resolved by premixing the bejesus out of it, no? That would save some pipework under the bonnet too. Get that lawnmower smell going!

User avatar
Phil Bate
Spin Doctor
Spin Doctor
Posts: 9256
Joined: Thu Mar 22, 2012 12:49 am
RX-8: 231
Colour: Sunlight Silver
Location: South Wales
Has thanked: 36 times
Been thanked: 169 times

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by Phil Bate » Sun Sep 08, 2013 12:40 am

You can get a flow rate adjuster for the sohn adaptor so you can set a rate manually that varies with the RPM and keep the OMP, as they when fitting the Renesis to light aircraft
Phil's subtle sunlight silver - stronger, faster, with added red bits and stuff engine donor!
Operation Mint - Kuro preservation project
The pimped out Glacier White XE - quintessential British motoring from Jaguar

User avatar
Arnie_O
Former Member
Former Member
Posts: 7743
Joined: Tue May 20, 2008 8:22 pm
RX-8: Turbo
Colour: Velocity Red
Location: South Ockendon, Essex
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 4 times

Re: Talking Carbs

Post by Arnie_O » Sun Sep 08, 2013 8:20 am

You may run in to issues with the intake manifold from racing beat clearing the firewall
I know the carb manifold from racing beat is what Slive is running on his race car however he has had the UIM fabricated to miss the firewall.
Something's else for you to bear in mind.
I am seriously looking forward to this build though
9000rpm 192ps beast. A proud member of the BoostJunkies Club.
Black Halo Racing Ignition Coil Kit & Light Flywheel + many Racing Beat and RE-Amemiya Parts
Essex Rotary Full Bridgeport with GReddy Boost & Essex Rotary Remap
Royal Purple 2 Cycle Premix
Home of RE-Amemiya's Super Dolphin

More Carbon Fiber Than You can Shake a Stick at
My Car Build BIG UPDATE 03/05/2012

Post Reply

Return to “Naturally Aspirated”