<<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by bc-49 »

HarSc wrote:
bc-49 wrote:
Wed Nov 03, 2021 7:30 pm
Caught one of the Red Flag incidents on my Go Pro. BMW spun just in front of me coming out of Luffield:
Blimey! Yeah, that's a fair punt he had into that wall, damage to his car looked pretty bad from what we saw coming past, side airbags and all :shock: :lol: caught a glimpse of it as we came round, we got the red flag for it when we were at the top of Hangar straight... He only just managed to keep it off the pit entry :!:



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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by HarSc »

He couldn't have picked a better phrase huh? :lol: Excuse the northern-ness of us two in the car :rofl: :rofl:
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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by Dr. FrankenRex »

Harry's gets pic of the day for me:
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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by HarSc »

Ooooh she's a beauty :lol:
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<<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

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Just like you Harry :snog:
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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by Boston Rotary »

So as this was my last track day this year I thought I’d clean the car change the wheels back over and replace all the brake pads. The car had other ideas. Washing it went well lol, 3 wheels off and changed pads went well. The last wheel front o/side decided it wasn’t/ isn’t coming off two wheel nut which are Allen key type have rounded off so other measures need to be taken. Here’s some pics of the remaining pads
2BC3D7ED-0D47-419D-B546-32213275ED16.jpeg
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Oh and it’s destroyed the Toyo catback.
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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by Vj4sothername »

Boston Rotary wrote:
2BC3D7ED-0D47-419D-B546-32213275ED16.jpeg

Wafer thin
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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by Boston Rotary »

Vj4sothername wrote:
Fri Nov 05, 2021 12:40 pm
Boston Rotary wrote:
2BC3D7ED-0D47-419D-B546-32213275ED16.jpeg

Wafer thin
Yep
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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by v-rex »

Checked my tyres and pressures today after Silverstone. Front left look like it's taken the biggest hit especially on outer shoulder. Front right seems ok and rears are fine. Pressures all needed topping up.

Think it must have been the right handers at the tracks I did. I can imagine Coram at Snetterton and corners like Stowe at Silverstone would have loaded it hard.

I'll get the alignment rechecked at some point soon and get the opinion of someone on the tyre and if I can continue using or should change. Maybe I had the pressures wrong or something is out on the front offside.

I did get everything aligned just before and reviews say these Potenza sports do wear quickly so maybe just expected behaviour. I also went a bit more towards understeer when I got it aligned so maybe that didn't help either. I'll go a touch more towards turn in steer and more towards oversteer under sustained cornering when I get it done next.

All very interesting and a learning experience as I start doing some trackdays.
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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by bc-49 »

I’d throw some additional front camber at it, certainly above 1. The additional camber will mean more of the tyre is getting used at load, rather than just the outer shoulder.

I’m running over 2 degrees on the front, but then I don’t really use my car on the road a huge amount.

You could also take out some rear toe, which will help to rotate the car on throttle. Most basic setups have quite a lot of toe out on the rear to promote stability/understeer balance.


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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by v-rex »

bc-49 wrote:
Fri Nov 05, 2021 5:33 pm
I’d throw some additional front camber at it, certainly above 1. The additional camber will mean more of the tyre is getting used at load, rather than just the outer shoulder.

I’m running over 2 degrees on the front, but then I don’t really use my car on the road a huge amount.

You could also take out some rear toe, which will help to rotate the car on throttle. Most basic setups have quite a lot of toe out on the rear to promote stability/understeer balance.


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Thanks very useful. Always a bit unnerving when you ask what you want from the alignment specialist. They did exactly what I asked for in terms of car feel, but what I thought I wanted was wasn't what the car really wanted it seems.

I'll mention these settings when I go next. By far the biggest thing I've struggled with was a bit of understeer on the faster corners. I thought it would be good to have a bit so I could get the power down, but then the rx8 I guess doesn't have enough power to oversteer by power alone so having the back end freer and ability to rotate by throttle a little is desirable. I guess some of this also comes from the diff, but good to know about rear toe as well.

Car is just a weekend car for going to kart events ... And now track days it seems. So happy to lean to a more track focused setup with camber.
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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by New Duke »

If you have alignment done, get it done by a specialist who can discuss your driving style. There are a few recommended around here. Aggressive settings will wear the tyres quickly in other places though, like the inside shoulders.

Pressures make a difference too as you know, you'll get a feel for it.

In the end it may be a fancy road tyre, but it's still a road tyre V and it was always going to suffer on a full, dry track day. That's why so many of us use cheaper track rubber. No daily road tyres will survive extended track use. When they do the track tests on channels like Tyre Reviews they're not smashing it around the track all day. They only do a few laps.
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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by v-rex »

New Duke wrote:
Fri Nov 05, 2021 10:36 pm
If you have alignment done, get it done by a specialist who can discuss your driving style. There are a few recommended around here. Aggressive settings will wear the tyres quickly in other places though, like the inside shoulders.

Pressures make a difference too as you know, you'll get a feel for it.

In the end it may be a fancy road tyre, but it's still a road tyre V and it was always going to suffer on a full, dry track day. That's why so many of us use cheaper track rubber. No daily road tyres will survive extended track use. When they do the track tests on channels like Tyre Reviews they're not smashing it around the track all day. They only do a few laps.
I used wheels in motion and in their defence I think they did set it up exactly as I asked for. They asked me a bunch of questions on how I want the car to feel in different parts of the corner and it does do that. I think before this it was set up to another extreme ( I wasn't around when this was done, after my subframe was done ) but I guess what I thought I wanted wasn't really what was needed when I went out on track.

I'll go back and maybe revise some of what I said next time now I've experienced these settings, and get it closer to an optimal setup. Might take a few iterations but I don't mind. I know alot of people rate Fergus, including yourself I believe, so I may also try to get out to him but Wheels in Motion in Chesham is so close to me that it's definitely the easiest option.

This is my 4th track day with my car in all the years I've had it and the first two Bedford and Donington were cold and wet respectively. Snetterton and Silverstone were hot and grippy and I think demonstrated a true track day stress load. It's amazing how no matter how hard you push on the road it pales in comparison with what you experience on track.

I think you are right to go with track day rubber and probably a brake upgrade, ndx bluestuff looking like a great option and Federals seem to be the de facto semi slicks option though I know there was a change recently. Nankangs seem like another decent option and it seems they have some new models due next year.

I also had a few concerns about my PZ alloys and in particular the centre caps maybe popping off when the wheel got hot so maybe another set of track alloys with race rubber is what I may go for if I can find space to keep them somewhere.

My engine with the recently upgraded koyo rad stayed lovely and cool on track with a peak of about 104C, so I think decent brakes and track rubber so I can stay out a bit longer would make these days even more fun!
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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by HarSc »

v-rex wrote:
Fri Nov 05, 2021 11:13 pm
It's amazing how no matter how hard you push on the road it pales in comparison with what you experience on track.
This :whathesaid: :lol: that definitely caught me by surprise. It's insane! :lol: love it though ha!

v-rex wrote:
Fri Nov 05, 2021 11:13 pm
I think you are right to go with track day rubber and probably a brake upgrade, ndx bluestuff looking like a great option
I've got Bluestuff NDX on the fronts of mine and had them at Silverstone, and while I wasn't giving them absolute hell still being a novice at tracking in the grand scheme of things, they held up well and never faded on me at all, always felt solid 8) would have thought they'd do you well :D
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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by New Duke »

The sweet spot for me was the softer Federal 595 compound of the 2, coupled with bluestuff NDX all round.

Since then I haven't been limited by tyres or brakes, even at a hot Snetterton. And it's happy on my wallet! But I guess different things will work for everyone.

I don't know all of Fergus' settings but I do know that he pushes the camber to the max at the front and back. I think that's about 1.5. The PZ and R3 suspension have toughy the same limit. That's plenty camber for me though.
I think he's quite aggressive with toe in at the front too. To the point that it noticeably affects my road wear. But I like the trade off. Can't remember what he likes to do at the back. (hehe)

(And you're way too modest about your track skills V... I've seen you look like an ace on the Kart!)
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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by bc-49 »

Image

Here’s my setup, over 2 degrees is possible on the stock components. (Not recommending this, just to say it’s doable)

Would imagine it’s toe out on the front that you mean, toe in would be a weird thing to do and wouldn’t help turn in.

I’m running EBC Blue with their blank discs and happy with the setup. Not quite the same feel on the pedal as Mintex 1144, but noticeably less metallic and kinder on the discs. They’re also very easy and cheap to get a hold of.


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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by New Duke »

bc-49 wrote:
Fri Nov 05, 2021 11:53 pm
Here’s my setup, over 2 degrees is possible on the stock components. (Not recommending this, just to say it’s doable)
The numbers were indeed foggy in my head. :thumleft:
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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by v-rex »

New Duke wrote:
Fri Nov 05, 2021 11:46 pm
(And you're way too modest about your track skills V... I've seen you look like an ace on the Kart!)
I think with time I will get much better. Some of the kart stuff translates to the road and some is slightly different. Braking and gear changes for a start but also corner entry. Racing lines mostly translate to an extent.

Alot of the problem was I was in my head alot thinking the car will fail me somehow. At Snetterton we heard a loud bang in the morning session under hard braking ( probably a clump of rubber in retrospect ) and I thought the worst. I was really lucky to have vj4sothername with me on both days so he'd check the car for me ( thanks John ) and we wouldn't find anything but it still takes up some mental bandwidth for me.

In the morning we had lots of judder under braking ( again probably clumps of rubber ) and then at points we came off track with the pagid pads smoking. It was really good to have Will come down and show how we don't need to brake so hard and once we cleared the clumps of rubber the car was smooth again. I was more comfortable in the afternoon but then struggled to hook up a decent lap due to traffic imo.

I think now I've made it through a few track days unscathed ( will get all the suspension components double checked though ) and I sort out pads and tyres I'll stop being such a Nervous Nellie. I was far too tentative at Silverstone and moving over way too much.

Past that me and John are already talking about a dedicated track car that you don't care so much about... Seeing Wayne and Pete with their slicks and harnesses ( and aero ) makes me envious. I am sure the limiting factor at Coram is me rather than the car currently. Just couldn't stop sliding in the seat!

Anyway baby steps ... Will start with tyres and pads first ;)
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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by v-rex »

bc-49 wrote:
Fri Nov 05, 2021 11:53 pm
Here’s my setup, over 2 degrees is possible on the stock components. (Not recommending this, just to say it’s doable)

Would imagine it’s toe out on the front that you mean, toe in would be a weird thing to do and wouldn’t help turn in.

I’m running EBC Blue with their blank discs and happy with the setup. Not quite the same feel on the pedal as Mintex 1144, but noticeably less metallic and kinder on the discs. They’re also very easy and cheap to get a hold of.

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Thanks for your exact setup. Very useful. I don't think I'll go to 2 degrees straight away but it seems I could definitely increase camber at the front. My tyre wear seems to show it's using too much shoulder so seems like a no brainer.

Then the rest looks like toe. I went too much the opposite way, from what I had. I still don't want it too aggressive I think, hard to explain but I'll maybe adjust gradually to more toe out on front and more toe neutral in the rear and see how it feels. Might take a few iterations but it will be a useful journey so I can feel how each change translates to the car.

Mintex 1155 and 1144 seemed to be a good suggestion and I think Conan used to recommend 1155 at the front and 1144 at the rear. (I guess in EBC land that's blue and yellow ). I don't think Mintex are R90 though but EBC are so that would be the easy clincher for me. I'm lazy.

Definitely would see how the EBC feel on the road but I hear good things. When I had my nissan 200sx I swapped to some mintex green pads and they used to have zero bite when cold so would prefer not to have that. Fantastic when warmed up I remember so I wouldn't mind trying Mintex if they are ok for the road as well.
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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by ChrisHolmes »

Mintex 1144s are fine for road use working well from cold but it does actually say on the box “Not for road use”
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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by Vj4sothername »

Did anyone happen to stumble upon a locking wheel nut key? Mine has gone AWOL.
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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by ChrisHolmes »

It will be out on the track somewhere, you won’t be the last to suffer from this problem at a track.
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Vj4sothername
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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by Vj4sothername »

ChrisHolmes wrote:It will be out on the track somewhere, you won’t be the last to suffer from this problem at a track.
This link will help https://mcgard.com/customer-service/ord ... nline-now/
North America only Image I'll just get a tool to trash them and put regulars on I think. Must have rolled out when I checked vinods pads.
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v-rex
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Re: <<<TRACKDAY Silverstone GP - Tuesday 2nd November SOLD OUT>>>

Post by v-rex »

Vj4sothername wrote:
Sat Nov 13, 2021 12:40 pm
ChrisHolmes wrote:It will be out on the track somewhere, you won’t be the last to suffer from this problem at a track.
This link will help https://mcgard.com/customer-service/ord ... nline-now/
North America only Image I'll just get a tool to trash them and put regulars on I think. Must have rolled out when I checked vinods pads.
Now I feel guilty..... :oops:
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